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Jay - slightly different in that in that SA refs vid there is only the tackler as an oppo player, In the McCaw incident Whitelock is also involved so it "looks" more like a ruck. There is obviously a distinct difference in that as a player you have a feel for the situation you are actually...

Inside Shoulder - I guess thats the nub of the entire issue - if you analyse that particular breakdown using the laws pendantically, it is not a ruck as there are no players on their feet over the ball. Green 6 goes off his feet initially to seal off, before regaining his footing but he still...

Scarfman - "The bigger question is why am I still arguing with you??" Because the laws of the game are both ambiguous and conradictory. 15.4 b - The tackler must immediately get up or move away from the tackled player and from the ball at once c- The tackler must get up before playing the ball...

I think McCaw did know what he doing (as Rolland suggested), in this case getting to his feet instead of rolling out - I guess he was pushing the envelope. In this test Rolland seemed quick to treat any breakdown as being in post tackle phase and pinged accordingly - eg Dagg's YC - which one...

Damo - I take it that because there is only 1 player (arguably) on their feet, that it isn't a ruck? This is probably the biggest area of contention in the whole game, (and the one that posters here disagree about the most imho)

Damo - I'd call that as a ruck - 2+ players bound over the ball on the ground at the time the ball carrier hits the deck. In my opinion RMC is pk'd because Rolland woul expect him to roll away from the ruck and in this case I think RMC gets to his feet knowing he is in the way but makes it look...

Thats why so many of the NZ Super rugby teams used that awful grey colour in both their home and reverse strips. After the ABs flopped in 2007 Adidas must have had 1000's of mtrs of it left over from the All Blacks "sliver grey" reverse jersey.

Fine as long as you come from behind !

BPC you are right McCaw had his hands on Louw as he was brought to ground, however I'd assume Clancy did not consider him to be one. He was right there and had a clear view. Mind you looking at the clip frame by frame as Louw was tackled and McCaw gettting hands on was about .3 of second so no...

Sorry guys should have posted the vid with the relevant time stamp

BPC - sorry to harp on about this - but McCaw was not the tackler so he doesnt have to release the ball carrier. (that is until it becomes a ruck/maul) Brodie Retallick was the tackler. McCaw was first man in after - have a look at the youtube vid on pg 1 of this thread Further to the Pile-up...

BPC , Scarf et all - Actually in relation to the point of offside etc , it doesnt matter whether its a ruck or a maul, IF RMC had played the ball at that point it became either he would have and should have been PK'd. (We all know this anyway) My opinion (and I think Damo's) is that while RMC...

I dont have a problem with the fetchers having a field day in that situation, I think you'd end up seeing better support and better pillars at the tackle / breakdown and maybe more numbers also, thus opening up the defensive lines a bit. .... maybe? maybe not?

Scotty - I think we all know this situation has arisen due to year in year out tinkering - one year the attacking team gets the benefit of a new ruling or focus, the next year the defending team benefits because the games rules committee decide the balance was wrong and so on. In my view to...

Scarfman - at the time RMC attacks the ball - it is a tackle - then Bekker arrives momentarily after, Ruan is waiting for the ball - not involved in the breakdown. - There are not multiple players driving over the ball, other than Louw on the ground there is Bekker only, but it is either a Maul...

Scarf - if everyone is lying all over the ball - it can be a maul - just an unplayable one - ref will blow it up surely.

This is a perfect example of why the game is so difficult for many people to understand. Some insist it was a ruck others say it was a maul. From the "available" evidence - eg a low res video, My view is : RMC joins the breakdown legally as 1st man in on his feet after Retallick has made the...

You forgot Tom Taylor (son of Warwick) - I rate him as the best 10 prospect of the lot of them

Who is this Max Bania anyway?- I cant ever recall seeing a rugby article written by him before. Reminds me of the big mouth expert on everything you often come across at a bbq or hear at the next leaner at the pub / club

Of course he will be missed - just as ANY international ref with years of experience would be missed. I dont know why you'd knock him when the AB's actually won far more than they lost under Dickinson. All refs are inconsistent, it's the nature of the job - different teams, different...