Wallabies 2025

[TSR]

BR - I think the squad selections are pretty spot on. There will always be 1-2 contentious picks but I think all of the selected players are justified and most, if not all, the players who missed out were either injured or didn’t show enough for Australia A. I think it also shows where the respective Super squads are at -
- the Brumbies have been the most consistent and highest ranking team but a couple of key omissions - Tua not eligible, Brown moved on, Cale, Schoup, Van Nek & Lonergan all missed a lot of footy due to injury, Hooper & Lachlan Lonergan pushed out due to competition. Swain is the only one I really never worked out why he never got a shot but I assume there is something specific from Schmidt
- Tahs had a very good core group of players but lacked depth and injuries decimated their front row they struggled. A good portion of their selections are new to their squad
- Reds - developing squad but I think your selection of the likely 23 is instructive. Reds had very good depth but have a lot of players who are second best in their position and still didn’t have the cohesion that the Brumbies had. But a large portion of the squad is 21 - 27, so they are the right age to figure prominently in the next 4 year cycle. Hence why they have a big contingent, but much lower numbers in the final 23.
- Force similiar to the Tahs - some good individuals but a higher continent of players not eligible and/or moved on

I think you selection of the 23 is pretty on the mark too. For there to be any significant change in the pecking order I assume it would come off the back of a really strong Super performance from one or more of the Tahs, Reds or Force and/or maybe a drop in form from someone like Slipper (or injuries of course).

 

[Adam84]

Ahh, the mysteries of squad and team selection.

We have a sqaud announced of 40 players, consisting of 14 Reds, 11 Tahs, 8 Brumbies and 7 Force. At face value. it looks to be a bit Reds heavy. But for the Tahs to have 11 reps after two seasons where they won only two games against the woeful Crusaders, surely that's enough to raise some eyebrows?

However, five of those Tahs were not part of the 2024 squad, 4 from the Rebels and one fron League. Still 6 looks to be generous against 8 for the Brumbies.

Brumbies actually have 9 and Tahs 10..

Referencing 2024 Super Rugby form then using squads for 2025 is a pointless exercise of parochialism given the changes which have taken place. Almost a quarter of those players list in the Wallabies squad have shifted clubs in the off-season.

Out of the Tahs 10 players; 5 ‘wallabies’ have joined the club in the off-season, 2 have joined the Force and 2 have joined the Reds, this is further compounded excluding other ‘wallaby’ players which are injured.

 

[Brumby Runner]

TSR, good thoughts, but Lachie Lonergan was also injured for a big part of SR24. The Brumbies were operating with Liam Bowron (U20s) off the bench for the late part of the season. I don't see him being edged out on form, rather because of unavailability and a good season 25 will bring him right back into consideration. I agree with Hooper's current situation and unfortunately for him I see him coming off the bench for the Brumbies in 25, injuries aside.

Surprised you didn't mention Cale and Schoupp along with the Tahs, Reds and Force players who might force their way in with a good Super season behind them. Cale would have to be on the stronger options competing with the likes of Gleeson and Uru. Schoupp will also be in the mix for Kailea's spot unless Slipper goes downhill faster than expected. Of course, Corey Toole could suddenly improve his defence and would still be an option if Schmidt wants a more attacking mindset in the backs. And not forgetting Feliuai who has been in two squads already but has the job in front of him to force Ikitau back to No 13. All are in the 21 - 27 age group you use for looking at future options.

From the Reds, I won't be surprised if Tim Ryan comes into the squad for the Lions but I think there is more likelihood that more Reds players will drop out of the squad than come into it.

To state the obvious, the Super comp in 25 will be critical to many of our players getting a Wallaby spot.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Brumbies actually have 9 and Tahs 10..

Referencing 2024 Super Rugby form then using squads for 2025 is a pointless exercise of parochialism given the changes which have taken place. Almost a quarter of those players list in the Wallabies squad have shifted clubs in the off-season.

Out of the Tahs 10 players; 5 ‘wallabies’ have joined the club in the off-season, 2 have joined the Force and 2 have joined the Reds, this is further compounded excluding other ‘wallaby’ players which are injured.

Oh, tell me more.

Tahs have Bell, Gleeson, Kailea, Tupou, Edmed, Gordon, Jorgensen, Kellaway, Lancaster, Pietsch and Sua'ali'i. That's 11 by my count.

Brumbies have Ala'alatoa, Frost, Pollard, Slipper, Valetini, Ikitau, Lolesio and Wright. That's 8 by my count. What do you know that hasn't yet been published?

I did make mention of all those changes around the franchises, but they make minimal change to the representative figures for the Brumbies, Reds and Force. Only the Tahs have had a significant intake of Wallabies from the Rebels and League.

 

[Adam84]

Oh, tell me more.

Tahs have Bell, Gleeson, Kailea, Tupou, Edmed, Gordon, Jorgensen, Kellaway, Lancaster, Pietsch and Sua'ali'i. That's 11 by my count.

Peitsch has joined the Force….

not only that, Kailea, Tupou, Kellaway, Lancaster and Sua’ali’i have joined the Tahs in the offseason and Bell was inured most of 2024.

I maintain that comparing Super Rugby 2024 standing as a KPI/metric to asses a Wallabies squad based on 2025 Super Rugby squads, is a pointless exercise of parochialism..

 

[Adam84]

If any position is objectively inflating figures for 2024 Super Rugby standings it’s the front row and halves, and I think it’s pretty clear why they’re bringing in wider players there…

We have fuck-all depth at THP/LHP/Hooker and 5/8 at test level, and most Super Rugby teams are struggling in these position as well with depth/injuries…

 

[Derpus]

Peitsch has joined the Force….

not only that, Kailea, Tupou, Kellaway, Lancaster and Sua’ali’i have joined the Tahs in the offseason and Bell was inured most of 2024.

I maintain that comparing Super Rugby 2024 standing as a KPI/metric to asses a Wallabies squad based on 2025 Super Rugby squads, is a pointless exercise of parochialism..

Isn't that our favourite pastime?

 

[dru]

Isn't that our favourite pastime?

Oh alright then, I’ll say it.

“Too many Tahs.”

 

[Brumby Runner]

Peitsch has joined the Force….

not only that, Kailea, Tupou, Kellaway, Lancaster and Sua’ali’i have joined the Tahs in the offseason and Bell was inured most of 2024.

I maintain that comparing Super Rugby 2024 standing as a KPI/metric to asses a Wallabies squad based on 2025 Super Rugby squads, is a pointless exercise of parochialism..

OK, have it your way. I was not lamenting the absence of Brumbies, just questioning whether all of the Tahs and Reds players were reflective of form to date and suggesting that some could be replaced after the upcoming Super season. I reckon I took a broad view of all four franchises, so I am at a loss to see where parochialism comes into it. My main intention was to present the difficulties faced by Schmidt et al in coming up with a squad at this early date.

But if you are so sensitive to the large number of Reds in the squad that you need to take a swipe at an opinion piece by a Brumbies supporter, then I would say that that is the attitude that has seen the number of Brumbies fans posting on this site dwindle over the years even when we have had the best side to follow for most of the time. .

 

[TSR]

TSR, good thoughts, but Lachie Lonergan was also injured for a big part of SR24. The Brumbies were operating with Liam Bowron (U20s) off the bench for the late part of the season. I don't see him being edged out on form, rather because of unavailability and a good season 25 will bring him right back into consideration. I agree with Hooper's current situation and unfortunately for him I see him coming off the bench for the Brumbies in 25, injuries

Sorry BR. Where I specifically mentioned Lachlan Lonergan, it should have been Ryan Lonergan. IMO a fit Lachlan Lonergan is better than Pollard. Personally I’d have both BPA & Nasser in front of both.

Toole is a great super rugby player but needs to significantly improve his defence to be a test player. For what it’s worth I think Cale also currently has some big work ons, but I think he could push his way into the test squad with an improvement in his physical play.

 

[Adam84]

But if you are so sensitive to the large number of Reds in the squad that you need to take a swipe at an opinion piece by a Brumbies supporter, then I would say that that is the attitude that has seen the number of Brumbies fans posting on this site dwindle over the years even when we have had the best side to follow for most of the time. .

Right. Are you going to blame me for the dwindling matchday crowds as well?

Correlation vs causation…

 

[TSR]

I maintain that comparing Super Rugby 2024 standing as a KPI/metric to asses a Wallabies squad based on 2025 Super Rugby squads, is a pointless exercise of parochialism..

Yeah, maybe. I think it’s a worthwhile discussion point as to why so many Reds players are getting a crack and points to an alignment in the programs of Kiss and what Schmidt is looking for.

But I won’t deny being pretty happy that it appears to be the Reds turn to get some favour from the selectors. It certainly won’t do our chances next season any harm.

 

[Sword of Justice]

It’s a squad picked on most recent test form for a camp occurring prior to a single game of Super Rugby being played. Bringing the debate back around to provincial pettiness is just cringy.

 

[TSR]

It’s a squad picked on most recent test form for a camp occurring prior to a single game of Super Rugby being played. Bringing the debate back around to provincial pettiness is just cringy.

Really? You don’t think there is anything interesting about there being 14 Reds in the squad. The individual stories within that aren’t worthy of discussion. Guys like De Lutiis, Blyth, Nasser.

In any case, what’s wrong with a bit of parochialism? Why is that petty?

I’m honestly both a bit lost of why this isn’t considered more of interest and why a bit of parochialism wouldn’t come into this on a rugby blog site. How is that cringy?

This isn’t meant to be a shot at any of you - I’m just quite surprised I seem to be in the minority here that thinks it’s of interest.

 

[Ignoto]

The Brumbies numbers will skew down over the next few years. With AAA and Slip's being over utilised by the Brumbies they're not giving the next generation time to develop.

The team BR picked is only highlighting what we've known for awhile, we do not have the quality of depth in our back line across Australia.

Looking at the Reds, the "nearly there's" of Lynagh, Hunter and Jock all play in positions where you either start or youre outside of the 23. Flook would be the only utility player that could come into the 23 and cover multiple positions but there's better players ahead of him.

And because it's silly season, on BR's team list, why should we not count Tupou, BPA and Slipper as Reds products? That'd significantly change the make up of the squad.

 

[TSR]

Good point. Ikitau & Lolesio also originally Queenslanders, aren’t they?

 

[Slim 293]

Good point. Ikitau & Lolesio also originally Queenslanders, aren’t they?

They both list their club as Tuggeranong…

I can only assume they spent their Friday nights in the Hyperdome food court.

100% Canberran.

 

[Adam84]

In any case, what’s wrong with a bit of parochialism? Why is that petty?

I’m honestly both a bit lost of why this isn’t considered more of interest and why a bit of parochialism wouldn’t come into this on a rugby blog site. How is that cringy?

This isn’t meant to be a shot at any of you - I’m just quite surprised I seem to be in the minority here that thinks it’s of interest.

Nothing wrong with a bit of parochialism and we shouldn’t shy away from admitting it when it is.

I only spoke to the complaints about Waratahs-Wallabies representation based off 2024 form, which I feel was a bit of a disingenuous/pointless argument given half of those NSW players listed weren’t Tahs in 2024, and Bell was injured most of the season.

 

[emuarse]

They both list their club as Tuggeranong…

I can only assume they spent their Friday nights in the Hyperdome food court.

100% Canberran.

Re: Post #76
Len Ikitau - of Samoan nationality but born in NZ. Parents moved to Queensland, & Len played schoolboy league atMarsden State High School, Logan City, QLD & then Rugby at Brisbane Boys' College
Noah Lolesio - born in Auckland NZ & educated at The sSouthport School, Gold Coast.
So they both commenced their rugby in Queensalnd.

 

[dru]

Re: Post #76
Len Ikitau - of Samoan nationality but born in NZ. Parents moved to Queensland, & Len played schoolboy league atMarsden State High School, Logan City, QLD & then Rugby at Brisbane Boys' College
Noah Lolesio - born in Auckland NZ & educated at The sSouthport School, Gold Coast.
So they both commenced their rugby in Queensalnd.

None of this matters. There is occasionally an heretical anti-Gnosticism in artificial limitation to the meaning of “Queenslander”. It’s an epiphany that addresses desire, and in the absence of desire, a physical location, even temporarily, at any point in life. “Queensland” is a state of mind, and if the Queenslander in case of point, denies this state of mind then the qualifying state of mind is any other individual Queenslander.

BR knows this but posts expressing his inner turmoil on the nature of being.