Northern Hemisphere/6N Rugby

[Wilson]

It's after the play has stopped (well and truly after the whistle) and off the ball, with head to head contact. Should be a red any day of the week. Just compare it to Darcy Swain's headbutt which got him a red for minimal force.

But I do agree with some of the outrage being confected - people who don't like the 20 minute red card are trying to blame it for the call, where as the ref and tmo just get this plain wrong in my book.

 

[Dctarget]

That's a good point about after the play. Silly stuff.

Will be curious to see how long the opposition goes for 20 minute reds. Feel like they'll give up in a year or two.

 

[Wilson]

Yeah, hard to know, but they've run out of steam in opposing a lot of other changes once they've seen the benefit - 50/22s the most obvious. Northern fans were decrying it as league nonsense that would ruin the game, but they're now almost universally loved.

I do think we need judiciary reform to help with some of the card changes, it feels like an absolute dice roll right now as to what sort of punishment two players get for the same action (more so as to whether they end up at the judiciary, 90% of all cases end up being 6 down to 3, -1 for tackle school). The other big one will be sternum height tackles - if we move forward with that a pro-level I think the opposition to the 20 minute red card will evaporate. Whether or not the same people opposing it on player welfare grounds accept sternum height tackles with open arms remains to be seen.

 

[Italophile]

Am I being unfair or is the outrage around Mauvaka's 'headbutt' on Ben White a little confected? I see head contact but it's not a headbutt.. I actually think White's recoil is mainly from the French prop's knee hitting him at the same time.

Plus White going all out Premier League footballer reaction, as if he'd been hit with a hammer.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Am I being unfair or is the outrage around Mauvaka's 'headbutt' on Ben White a little confected? I see head contact but it's not a headbutt.. I actually think White's recoil is mainly from the French prop's knee hitting him at the same time.

I thought it was a bit Hollywood, yes. I'm not convinced there was much contact at all, though it was very silly from the French player. Could have easily been a red.

 

[Italophile]

Looks like another Premiership rugby club circling the plughole. Newcastle having to borrow £4m from the other clubs and CVC to meet the Prem's financial requirements. No promotion/relegation again this season because the top Championship clubs have failed to meet the Prem's minimum stadium standards. So Newcastle, currently bottom, will stay up but the future looks bleak. If they fold, the comp will be down to 9 teams. Unsustainable.

 

[Derpus]

Looks like another Premiership rugby club circling the plughole. Newcastle having to borrow £4m from the other clubs and CVC to meet the Prem's financial requirements. No promotion/relegation again this season because the top Championship clubs have failed to meet the Prem's minimum stadium standards. So Newcastle, currently bottom, will stay up but the future looks bleak. If they fold, the comp will be down to 9 teams. Unsustainable.

They’ve obviously failed to sufficiently invest in mid-level Australian locks and flankers.

 

[Wilson]

Looks like another Premiership rugby club circling the plughole. Newcastle having to borrow £4m from the other clubs and CVC to meet the Prem's financial requirements. No promotion/relegation again this season because the top Championship clubs have failed to meet the Prem's minimum stadium standards. So Newcastle, currently bottom, will stay up but the future looks bleak. If they fold, the comp will be down to 9 teams. Unsustainable.

With the Welsh surely looking at top to bottom reform of their system, I think we're getting pretty close to an Anglo-Welsh league. What that means for Scotland, Ireland and the rest of the URC remains to be seen, but I think the economic pressures make a British and Irish league very likely going forward.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Looks like another Premiership rugby club circling the plughole. Newcastle having to borrow £4m from the other clubs and CVC to meet the Prem's financial requirements. No promotion/relegation again this season because the top Championship clubs have failed to meet the Prem's minimum stadium standards. So Newcastle, currently bottom, will stay up but the future looks bleak. If they fold, the comp will be down to 9 teams. Unsustainable.

Doncaster actually met the Prems minimum requirements.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

With the Welsh surely looking at top to bottom reform of their system, I think we're getting pretty close to an Anglo-Welsh league. What that means for Scotland, Ireland and the rest of the URC remains to be seen, but I think the economic pressures make a British and Irish league very likely going forward.

Or considering CVC has a stake in both the Premiership and URC perhaps a merger between the two.

 

[Wilson]

Or considering CVC has a stake in both the Premiership and URC perhaps a merger between the two.

There's been a bit of talk about a merger and that might be one way of getting there, but I'm not sure that's a sustainable end result.

Possibly they'll merge with the idea of then splitting I to a British isles comp and a new European one with the Italian teams playing alongside teams from Georgia, Spain, Portugal, etc., but South Africa is an awkward fit for either side of that.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Is there any talk in England about setting the salary cap at a sensible level underwhich clubs can actually afford to stay solvent?

 

[Dctarget]

Looks like another Premiership rugby club circling the plughole. Newcastle having to borrow £4m from the other clubs and CVC to meet the Prem's financial requirements. No promotion/relegation again this season because the top Championship clubs have failed to meet the Prem's minimum stadium standards. So Newcastle, currently bottom, will stay up but the future looks bleak. If they fold, the comp will be down to 9 teams. Unsustainable.

Why, what's the point of that? They have the most miserable existence. Months between wins etc. Their best players constantly leaving mid-season. It's paying $4 million to keep life support on for your 100 year old grandma who's been in a coma for 10 years. Time to move on.

 

[Crashy]

jeez that comp is seriously imploding. time to reduce the salary cap drastically. Saracens gone, London Irish gone, Wasps gone...

 

[Dctarget]

jeez that comp is seriously imploding. time to reduce the salary cap drastically. Saracens gone, London Irish gone, Wasps gone...

Sarries were relegated for the opposite reason but only went down for a year. Worcester Warriors are the third permanently gone.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

jeez that comp is seriously imploding. time to reduce the salary cap drastically. Saracens gone, London Irish gone, Wasps gone...

Apparently both Irish and Worcester are looking to be competing full time again in the next 18 months. Worcester is looking to enter the Championship in the 25/26 season while Irish is planning on 26/27.

 

[Italophile]

Apparently both Irish and Worcester are looking to be competing full time again in the next 18 months. Worcester is looking to enter the Championship in the 25/26 season while Irish is planning on 26/27.

Worcester, at least, have a stadium and training ground. Irish have neither.

 

[Italophile]

Why, what's the point of that? They have the most miserable existence. Months between wins etc. Their best players constantly leaving mid-season. It's paying $4 million to keep life support on for your 100 year old grandma who's been in a coma for 10 years. Time to move on.

Quite.

 

[molman]

It's after the play has stopped (well and truly after the whistle) and off the ball, with head to head contact. Should be a red any day of the week. Just compare it to Darcy Swain's headbutt which got him a red for minimal force.

But I do agree with some of the outrage being confected - people who don't like the 20 minute red card are trying to blame it for the call, where as the ref and tmo just get this plain wrong in my book.

I don't think you can put it on the referee who did give it a yellow and an off field review. It's Tempest (TMO) and the off field review who had all the time in the world who should have upgraded it to a Red. I'm still struggling with how inconsistent some of the TMOs are. Especially when fans watching a broadcast seem to be able to pick out clear issues, but the TMOs with all their camera angles seem to struggle and will totally miss some things and then suddenly inject for others. How this wasnt a clear Red is concerning as to how the referee team are making decisions and/or what impact the nature of the event is having on their decision making.

Anyway, It seem the citing commissioner agreed with my assessment and it's been upgraded to a red.

 

[Wilson]

I don't think you can put it on the referee who did give it a yellow and an off field review. It's Tempest (TMO) and the off field review who had all the time in the world who should have upgraded it to a Red. I'm still struggling with how inconsistent some of the TMOs are. Especially when fans watching a broadcast seem to be able to pick out clear issues, but the TMOs with all their camera angles seem to struggle and will totally miss some things and then suddenly inject for others. How this wasnt a clear Red is concerning as to how the referee team are making decisions and/or what impact the nature of the event is having on their decision making.

Anyway, It seem the citing commissioner agreed with my assessment and it's been upgraded to a red.

It is more on the TMO than ref and definitely should've been upgraded by the TMO, but I think what's there warrants an on field red (not just a 20 minute one), given it happens well and truly after the whistle.