Interesting article brought to my attention on Twitter
https://theconversation.com/not-so-gentle-giants-how-rugby-players-are-getting-bigger-23978
https://theconversation.com/not-so-gentle-giants-how-rugby-players-are-getting-bigger-23978
The Growth Of (Not In) Rugby Players
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RedsFanDan
Frank Row (1)
Thanks for posting this up for me.
Does anyone think the author is right to be worried about attracting grass roots players and losing the "everyone has a role" culture of rugby?
Does anyone think the author is right to be worried about attracting grass roots players and losing the "everyone has a role" culture of rugby?
Absolutely. Having played rugby from 10 till mid 20s, I loved the fact that it really did suit all types. Watching my son play the past 2 years, aged 11 and 12, I was struck by how big many kids are at that age, and how much smaller many are. Obviously junior rules make allowances for size discrepancies, but the frightening size of some kids at 14 and 15 is certainly off-putting.
The incentive for kids in their mid-teens who are half-decent to "build up" to compete is worrying.
Dumbledore
Dick Tooth (41)
Studiously avoided mentioning PEDs I note.
There's still a place for 'smaller' players in the game. Ben Smith, JOC (James O'Connor), Wade over in Engerland, Tanaka the Highlanders scrumhalf is smaller than me I'm by no means big.
What is going to be a challenge, especially in Australia, is the enormous size differences around the U15/16 age groups. If you're a small kid, who loves sport, and you've got the choice between playing footy, soccer or rugby at some point the physicality of each sport is going to become a factor.
There's still a place for 'smaller' players in the game. Ben Smith, JOC (James O'Connor), Wade over in Engerland, Tanaka the Highlanders scrumhalf is smaller than me I'm by no means big.
What is going to be a challenge, especially in Australia, is the enormous size differences around the U15/16 age groups. If you're a small kid, who loves sport, and you've got the choice between playing footy, soccer or rugby at some point the physicality of each sport is going to become a factor.
RedsFanDan
Frank Row (1)
Do you think drugs are the issue when it comes to the increase in player height and weight though? I'm 1.8m and ~80kgs and the national Australian average is 175cm and 86kgs. Ben Smith is 187cm and 91kgs, JOC (James O'Connor) is 180cm and 88kgs so these scrawny guys in rugby terms are above average. Will we see another Gregan or Williams I wonder?
I have a two week old son now and I would like him to play rugby but as he's half asian it's likely he'll be quite small. It's looking more and more unlikely he'd ever be selected as anything other than a 9 or 11/14 and even then it seems size is trumping at least a bit of skill or speed.
Mortal Wombat
Allen Oxlade (6)
G'day all, long time lurker, first time poster here. This topic made me crawl out of the woodwork because I happen to have been talking about it to my old man last week. He's teacher who just retired from Joeys after 3 decades in the place, having coached many Wallabies at u14 and u15 level, including Burke and Beale.
He says that maybe the best footballer he ever saw in the first VX was Graeme Thompson, who played in the centres around 1990, with 3 caps for the Australian Schoolboys. Highly skilful and an excellent defender, Thompson never kicked on to representative honours as an adult, because he just didn't grow big enough.
So maybe the size requirements are even more extreme now in the professional era, but there is a good argument to be made that it was always thus.
He says that maybe the best footballer he ever saw in the first VX was Graeme Thompson, who played in the centres around 1990, with 3 caps for the Australian Schoolboys. Highly skilful and an excellent defender, Thompson never kicked on to representative honours as an adult, because he just didn't grow big enough.
So maybe the size requirements are even more extreme now in the professional era, but there is a good argument to be made that it was always thus.
twenty seven
Tom Lawton (22)
There are many who are big at 14/15 and eventually get caught up to as they do not grow much more. Then there are those who don't shoot up until about 17. I haven't heard of drugs for height when involved in sport but I have seen steroids for strength when kids hit 14 and 15 which is sad. Not one that I know of went on due to serious injuries sustained.
There are a few who become the giants at over 200cm and maintain an agility to be able to scoop up loose ball off the ground at a good speed.
There are a few who become the giants at over 200cm and maintain an agility to be able to scoop up loose ball off the ground at a good speed.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
^^^ 25 pages into this thread http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/community/threads/continued-decline-in-sydney-junior-rugby.13716/, along with the analysis of the reality behing the ARU Annual Report player participation figures would suggest that the answer tio the above question is a resounding NO.
But.... Where rugby is "popular" and there are large numbers of players in the U16-U18 age groups (AAGPS, and CAS Schools in Sydney), there is no concession for weight disparities. Team composition is determined based on player skill level.
For many this "skill level" assessment was made in year 7 at Under 13 level, and there is not all that much movement between the teams as the kids develop and mature. Most of the 13C's end up in the 16C's, and 3rd XV or 4th XV in the opens.
IIRC, I have never heard any whispers of the AAGPS or CAS administrators considering weight divisions within their competitions.
But.... Where rugby is "popular" and there are large numbers of players in the U16-U18 age groups (AAGPS, and CAS Schools in Sydney), there is no concession for weight disparities. Team composition is determined based on player skill level.
For many this "skill level" assessment was made in year 7 at Under 13 level, and there is not all that much movement between the teams as the kids develop and mature. Most of the 13C's end up in the 16C's, and 3rd XV or 4th XV in the opens.
IIRC, I have never heard any whispers of the AAGPS or CAS administrators considering weight divisions within their competitions.
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
I grew up in an era when there were weight limits at Primary School level. My best friend, who was a very good footballer (represented CHS Firsts) was too heavy, so he starting taking his mother's laxatives to try to lose weight! He never managed to lose enough.
I really have mixed feelings about grading players according to weight. Age matters far more than weight, a year can make a huge difference until the late teens. Not to mention differences in body composition.
I can see the dangers of big kids who are early maturers up against smaller, less well developed, kids of the same age. But it seems to me that putting these bigger kids up against players who are a year or more older is just as fraught with danger.
In other words, I do not have a clue what the right answer is. Sorry.
I really have mixed feelings about grading players according to weight. Age matters far more than weight, a year can make a huge difference until the late teens. Not to mention differences in body composition.
I can see the dangers of big kids who are early maturers up against smaller, less well developed, kids of the same age. But it seems to me that putting these bigger kids up against players who are a year or more older is just as fraught with danger.
In other words, I do not have a clue what the right answer is. Sorry.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
Stop it- Resist - No .... don't....
Oh WTF just give in and say it....You know you want to...
The right answer is simple. Rebels.
Pity that this was so long ago @Wamberal. If this was today, your mate would fit in nicely at the Rebels after recent disclosures about their preparation for the Force game.
Thank you, Thank You. I'm here all week folks, with a matinee on Sunday.
I'll see myself out.
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