Shute Shield 2018

[Inside Shoulder]

I don't understand why the clubs (Subbies & Shute) can't all be affiliated with the one union. As far as i can see the major problem in Australian rugby stems from governance - why is there so much?

I would like to see all club rugby look after by the NSWRU in NSW, but even if that is too big of a step how about we have one organisation looking after rugby in Sydney, stop the crap of districts and have just clubs playing in a competition with a maximum of 3 grades per club with colts and women's.

the idea is fine but people tell me 3 team comps are difficult because you just don't have enough canon fodder.

 

[wamberal]

Bandar,


The clubs cannot be forced to accept anything they don't like. They are all essentially amateur organisations, run by volunteers in the main. There is no leverage, in other words. They are their own masters (and mistresses).

 

[Bandar]

The clubs cannot be forced to accept anything they don't like. They are all essentially amateur organisations, run by volunteers in the main. There is no leverage, in other words. They are their own masters (and mistresses).

Therein lies the major problem with the code in Australia - self interest.

As long at my club is going well nothing is wrong...

 

[Pfitzy]

Whoever said First Grade starts same time in Subbies and top 4 Divisions - Divisions 5 & 6 kick off at 3:15PM. Anything different there?

have just clubs playing in a competition with a maximum of 3 grades per club with colts and women's.

Bingo. And not to say they can't have social grades playing earlier in the day. Have a Masters comp run ad-hoc so that the old blokes like me can still have a trot. Make it Saturday morning or something.

Run women's rugby in two divisions at a separate location except finals, but on Saturday afternoon you're looking at

Thirds 11:30AM - 30 minute halves
Colts 12:45PM - 35 minute halves
Seconds 2PM - 35 minute halves
Firsts 3:15PM - 40 minute halves

As usual

 

[Done that]

At least Penrith have been able to put 7 teams on the park each week so far.
The same can't be said for every other club.

 

[Pfitzy]

At least Penrith have been able to put 7 teams on the park each week so far.
The same can't be said for every other club.

Agreed - Parramatta haven't put Colts 3 on the park yet.

 

[wamberal]

Therein lies the major problem with the code in Australia - self interest.

As long at my club is going well nothing is wrong.

When every year is a struggle for survival, self-interest means that you are just doing what you have to. What, exactly, does "doing well" mean?

 

[Spieber]

Team lists for round three:
Gordon (1-15) Sean Dillon, Cody Blackhurst, Raven Nurse, Jack Falloon, Jack Margin, Nick Brown, Mitch Lockley, Talalelei Moli, Mike Kennedy, Pat Toeta, Kim Bateman, Luke Lough, Alec Palmer, Sam Mete, Bill Freeman.
Penrith (1-15) Lisiate Vaihu, Ezzekial Seia, Adrian Silva, Taunola Kei, Mike Tua, Halaliku Matangi, Matt Faogali, Willie Toala, Saia Fapuiaki, David Isopo, Fatai Tuitauvki, Talia Tuaau, Delroy Tapusi, Paulo Halaifonua, Campbell Hislop.

Southern Districts v Manly​

Southern Districts (1-15) Conor Young, Liam Dwyer, Shambeckler Vui, Angus Ryan, Fili Tufui, Alex Perez, Conor Mitchell, Marcus Carbone, Eli Pilz, Christian Kagiassis, Rowland-Keni Kotabalavu, Denny Godinet, William Latu, Luke Smart, Jamie Verran.
Manly (1-15) Mokani Fuavao, James Hilterbrand, Alex Westgarth, Samuel Shires, Adrian Hall, Harry Bergelin, Kotoni Ale, Brad Hemopo, Tim Donlan, Nicolas Holton, Alex Northam, Kevin Fuavao, Dennis Pili-Gaitau, Mick Adams, Josh Turner.

Randwick v Eastern Suburbs​

Randwick (1-15) Kiernan Rabie, Adam Freier, Cam Betham, Lewis Taie, Tom Nowlan, Anthony Vasilis, Jack Hayson, Ikapote Tupai, Max Page, Bryan Croke , Christian Yasmin, Ben Starkey, Devon Stoltz, Latu Latinipalu, Andrew Kellaway.
Eastern Suburbs (1-15) Cody Walker, Connal McInerney, Ofa Fainga’anuku, Jack Digby, Ryan McCauley, Brodie Wilson, Rowan Perry, Lachie Pigott, Jack Grant, Mack Mason, Nemani Matirewa, Ned Yeomans, Sam Fogarty, Charlie Clifton, Archie King.

Northern Suburbs v Eastwood​

Northern Suburbs (1-15) Ezra Luxton, Sam Kitchen, Kali Tawake, Connor Vest, Hugh Sinclair, Leon Akopian, Taylor Francis, Gary Bautz, Nick Duffy, Angus Sinclair, Lochie Creagh, Irae Simone, Nathan Russell, Richard Woolf, Sam Giltrap.
Eastwood (1-15) Dean Doumbos, Edward Craig, Robert Lagudi, James Neale, Rhys Allen, George Kent, Tom Murphy, Patrick Sio, Michael Snowden, Jackson Bird, Zachery Mackay, Blake Sutton, Pama Fou, Fabian Goodall, Liam Windon.

Sydney Uni v West Harbour​

Sydney Uni (1-15) Alex Batho, Stewart Nutt, Wayne Borsak, Jack Sherratt, David McDuling, Ratu Rotasolia, Nick Champion de Crespigny, Rohan O’Regan, Theo Strang, Daniel Poletto, James Kane, William McDonnell, Harry Potter, Guy Porter, Tim Clements.
West Harbour (1-15) David Lolohea, Andrew Tuala, Nigel Vaifale, Kawa Leauma, Albert Tuisue, Phil Potgieter, Jake Kay, Kelly Meafua, Dion Spice, Sam Malcolm, Justin Marsters, Benjamin Cotton, Graeme Kolomalu, Jack Sullivan, Kodie Drury-Hawkins.

Warringah v Parramatta​

Warringah (1-15) Rory O’Connor, Luke Holmes, Harry Rorke, Sam Thomson, Jack Tomkins, Max Girdler, Maclean Jones, Sam Ward, Josh Holmes, Myles Dorrian, Harley Attwater, Sailosi Tagicakibau, Seb Wileman, Tyson Davis, Dave Feltscheer.
Parramatta (1-15) Brandon Fa’avae Eli, Jordan Ieremia, Inia Qereqeretabua, Tuitakau Kioa, Sev Domoni, James King, Adrian Musico, Andrew Vatuvei, Puka Malo, Hilton Gibbons, KJ Lam, Josh Tupuola, Niko Malo, Hayden Cole, Jaline Graham.

 

[Pfitzy]

Something I was thinking of - and noticed on Penrith's FB page as well: very few players backing up multiple grades. That, at least, is a step in the right direction.

 

[Rugby Central]

the idea is fine but people tell me 3 team comps are difficult because you just don't have enough canon fodder.

That's because the thinking is around social rugby. If you have representative District Clubs, you pick a match day 23 and all other players go back to their local Club for game time.

Injuries not withstanding teams can & should be picked before Tuesday training. For any late injuries or replacements make the call to the local Clubs. If a player doesn't want to play rep footy (because that's what it will be) off the bench then find someone who does. If they're currently that kind of SS clubman it's not likely they're all that helpful at the moment.

And you don't need three grades + Colts. First Grade, possibly a reserve grade (unnecessary with match day 23 squad), Colts and women's. All of sudden you have only the best players taking the field. With the shortened program games can be played when all those Subbies and schoolboy rugby fans can go to the games. The quality of Shute is good enough to command crowds equal to Super Rugby, if only they were played at a time when the diehard fans could get there.

Not to mention the genuine tribalism of entire districts cheering on "Their" Club's players making a more electric atmosphere usually reserved for matches such as Marlins vs Rats.

 

[Dave Beat]

With the shortened program games can be played when all those Subbies and schoolboy rugby fans can go to the games. The quality of Shute is good enough to command crowds equal to Super Rugby, if only they were played at a time when the diehard fans could get there.

Not to mention the genuine tribalism of entire districts cheering on "Their" Club's players making a more electric atmosphere usually reserved for matches such as Marlins vs Rats.

Hi there RC
Commanding crowds equal to Super Rugby crowds - those crowds are aren't really that great, and they draw on all supporters of the state that aren't playing.
I know I, and many others like going to watch more than one game of rugby.
I know a number of people who told there wives to stop buying season super rugby passes, but buy a SS Season pass because it is an afternoon of rugby with BBQ, and drinks and the kids get to join in.
This is from a supporter not a player, so the views may change.
What do other supporters want, it is the supporters, sponsors that are making the SS what it is - oops and the great players that mix with the juniors on the day.

There was no indication of what day and time these top 23 would play?

 

[I like to watch]

That's because the thinking is around social rugby. If you have representative District Clubs, you pick a match day 23 and all other players go back to their local Club for game time.

Injuries not withstanding teams can & should be picked before Tuesday training. For any late injuries or replacements make the call to the local Clubs. If a player doesn't want to play rep footy (because that's what it will be) off the bench then find someone who does. If they're currently that kind of SS clubman it's not likely they're all that helpful at the moment.

And you don't need three grades + Colts. First Grade, possibly a reserve grade (unnecessary with match day 23 squad), Colts and women's. All of sudden you have only the best players taking the field. With the shortened program games can be played when all those Subbies and schoolboy rugby fans can go to the games. The quality of Shute is good enough to command crowds equal to Super Rugby, if only they were played at a time when the diehard fans could get there.

Not to mention the genuine tribalism of entire districts cheering on "Their" Club's players making a more electric atmosphere usually reserved for matches such as Marlins vs Rats.

How is this different from the NRC?
And if it is, why would be anymore popular than the NRC?(which is about as popular as a cold sore)

 

[Dave Beat]

How is this different from the NRC?
And if it is, why would be anymore popular than the NRC?(which is about as popular as a cold sore)

True that is another way of looking at it, I haven't made it to many NRC games at all - and I've struggled to watch them on the box as well.

 

[Rugby Central]

DB:
"Commanding crowds equal to Super Rugby crowds - those crowds are aren't really that great" - As even the most one eyed Marlin fan, are you telling me Manly gets over 10,000 to every game - even at Penrith. I'd say any improvement, particularly those Clubs currently struggling would love to see bigger crowds.
"I know I, and many others like going to watch more than one game of rugby" - While my suggestion is just that, a suggestion, it has 3 games. 1st Grade, Colts & Women's.
"buy a SS Season pass because it is an afternoon of rugby with BBQ, and drinks and the kids get to join in" - Who said that has to change. I'm making a suggestion that brings the whole rugby community together and an obvious pathway. The way the day is run is still up to the Clubs.

"What do other supporters want, it is the supporters, sponsors that are making the SS what it is" - Your right, what do the supporters want? Given what's happening out there with player numbers declining, Clubs folding, and the game itself being ridiculed constantly, I'm not sure they want the status quo unchanged.
"I haven't made it to many NRC games at all - and I've struggled to watch them on the box" - Why is that? Because there's no affiliation or developed relationship with a team created from nowhere.
"There was no indication of what day and time these top 23 would play?" - The competition is a suggestion. But with only 3 matches the logistics for Friday night, Saturday afternoon, Saturday night or Sunday afternoon, instantly become more manageable.

ILTW:
"How is this different from the NRC?" - It's locally based on historically existing Clubs. It's a real pathway from juniors, to seniors to rep footy. Nearly all NRC sides are picked from various sources with little relevance to where they play their club rugby. In the competition suggested there is associated Colts and Women's team's to support. And without the NRC Super players not required for Wallaby duties can play for their clubs.

Please don't get me started on the bullshit restriction placed on bench players from club rugby. That's a whole other issue that a competition like this could address.

You want to see change, you want to see development, you want SS to have the respect it deserves, but point blank refuse to accept that the very competition that lies at the heart of Rugby Union in NSW (if not Australia) should make a single compromise to achieve this.

I love your passion and your support for the Marlins is unquestionable. But please stop pretending you want better for the game when you won't countenance any change to that current situation that is leading rugby down a path of irrelevance.

 

[Dave Beat]

RC I'm not against ideas being shared as they all have the small 1%ers that make our game great.

I think since the ARU passed those famous comments about the SS the competition has gone from strength to strength, hope the trajectory continues. What is also surprising is Uni has come back to the pack / actually I think others have improved which is better for the code.

I do want better for the game, some readers on this forum who are also volunteers for their clubs are very much like me and we share and support the contributions being made by each other as not one person can do it for all of club land.

Happily going to support rugby at Southern Districts tomorrow to cheer on Marlins, but yeah pay at the gate and buy a burger or 2 as well.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

RC I'm not against ideas being shared as they all have the small 1%ers that make our game great.

I think since the ARU passed those famous comments about the SS the competition has gone from strength to strength, hope the trajectory continues. What is also surprising is Uni has come back to the pack / actually I think others have improved which is better for the code.

I do want better for the game, some readers on this forum who are also volunteers for their clubs are very much like me and we share and support the contributions being made by each other as not one person can do it for all of club land.

Happily going to support rugby at Southern Districts tomorrow to cheer on Marlins, but yeah pay at the gate and buy a burger or 2 as well.

Get an Uber and really help their cashflow

 

[Dave Beat]

Get an Uber and really help their cashflow

lost me?

 

[Inside Shoulder]

lost me?

 

[Dave Beat]

View attachment 9879

Save that for the week after, when I support another away game.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

How is this different from the NRC?
And if it is, why would be anymore popular than the NRC?(which is about as popular as a cold sore)

Well, club advocates point to the importance and tribalism of the game at that level. In my opinion if the Shute Shield seriously wants to be the true 3rd Tier or domestic championship they need to re-align how they compete. While previously I have supported the idea of a reduction of grades that is unlikely to ever happen. So, instead of that I would suggest that they look to do similar to what they did in the Tooheys New Cup. Create an Elite squad which would be the current 1st grade but not directly competing in the local competition. Elevate all the remaining grades up one. So 2nds would become the new 1sts etc. who will compete exclusively in the local competition.

From there. They need to actually look to seriously involve other regions. Whether they are clubs or rep squads from them. So, look to get Tuggeranong involved and a Melbourne rep squad. Perhaps if possible the same with Perth.

This would essentially use the Shute Shield as the basis for the competition. All teams will still be linked to their clubs playing on the same day at the same ground as everyone else.