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Reds 2018

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joeyjohnz

Sydney Middleton (9)
That's not good for him. Surely then Thorn has to bring DP in at 12 - the two big centres smashing through everyone approach hasn't worked too well in attack and defence. Maybe against the Hurricanes we can have some creativity?
I think the major problem is they haven't had any decent ball. None of Thorne's 10's are good enough to be the only ball player in the backline, and consequently our attack's looked disjointed with some occasional sparkles of individual flair. If Kerevi & CFS are Thorne's long-term centre pairing (and I think they should be with both still 24) we're going to need a ball playing fullback to help with balance.

DP is certainly that player short term.
 

Zero_Cool

Arch Winning (36)
I think the most optimistic would agree we aren't likely to play finals football. With potential wins against Waratahs, Blues, Rebels, and Sunwolves. Considering the cluster of teams between 25 and 23 points (Rebels, Jaguars, Bulls, Sharks, and Stormers) they should nail down those last two wild card spots.

Given this what does this mean for the team, for selection etc?

Do we start so of our young guys (Sorovi, Stewart, ASY (Angus Scott-Young), Wright) bring some of the veterans to the bench (Higgers, Smith, Slipper, Douglas)?

Do we wait until after the Hurricanes / Highlanders onslaughts are done with before making changes?
 

RedsHappy

Tony Shaw (54)
I think the most optimistic would agree we aren't likely to play finals football. With potential wins against Waratahs, Blues, Rebels, and Sunwolves. Considering the cluster of teams between 25 and 23 points (Rebels, Jaguars, Bulls, Sharks, and Stormers) they should nail down those last two wild card spots.

Given this what does this mean for the team, for selection etc?

Do we start so of our young guys (Sorovi, Stewart, ASY (Angus Scott-Young), Wright) bring some of the veterans to the bench (Higgers, Smith, Slipper, Douglas)?

Do we wait until after the Hurricanes / Highlanders onslaughts are done with before making changes?

Given that, all the 2019 departees and as much of the waning old guard as feasible should be on the periphery from now on and, as you say, the only smart 'get something better ready for 2019' strategy is to pile on young players and those that look like they can be and are committed to skills growth and personal development.

In any event all the QRU's recent 'prestige' hirings have been more or less disastrous or just poor or very overrated - JO'C, Hunt, Goramaru, Smith, QC (Quade Cooper), Douglas.

The QRU - in one of many tragic misjudgements - focussed on the foolish illusion that injecting expensive prestige players would compensate for their appalling coaching appointment decisions.
 

RedsHappy

Tony Shaw (54)
Fellow posters, when you have a sec have a look at:

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...-stuart-lancaster-johnny-sexton-a8349451.html

Lancaster was seriously interested in the Reds HC job (and coming to live in Australia) after leaving England as HC. During that is one of the QRU's infamous 'global searches for a new Reds' HC'.

QRU of course knew better than to sign him. Either reaffirmed Graham or later hired Stiles.

Look via that article at what Lancaster has done at Leinster and what one of the world's best players - Sexton - has to say about Lancaster's coaching skills and contribution to Leinster's success in the Champions Cup.

Here we are today with Thorn and his two fine ACs. Drowning in a cascade of excuses and apologies and crowd levels that are little but a painful embarrassment to any rugby-loving QLD-er.
 

SouthernX

John Thornett (49)
Fellow posters, when you have a sec have a look at:

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...-stuart-lancaster-johnny-sexton-a8349451.html

Lancaster was seriously interested in the Reds HC job (and coming to live in Australia) after leaving England as HC. During that is one of the QRU's infamous 'global searches for a new Reds' HC'.

QRU of course knew better than to sign him. Either reaffirmed Graham or later hired Stiles.

Look via that article at what Lancaster has done at Leinster and what one of the world's best players - Sexton - has to say about Lancaster's coaching skills and contribution to Leinster's success in the Champions Cup.

Here we are today with Thorn and his two fine ACs. Drowning in a cascade of excuses and apologies and crowd levels that are little but a painful embarrassment to any rugby-loving QLD-er.

Dude you need to get over it. What’s done is done...

You really believed that world wide coaching search bullshit the reds gave us fans? When have the reds ever hired a coach from outside of Australia?

I understand your frustration mate with how this season has gone but fact is we did not have the money for a external head coach (still paying off the previous failures in Stiles) hence why our HC was promoted internally & nor did we have a full offseason to do a coaching search because the decision to move to Thorn happened in October.
 

The torpedo

Peter Fenwicke (45)
Lancaster was seriously interested in the Reds HC job (and coming to live in Australia) after leaving England as HC. During that is one of the QRU's infamous 'global searches for a new Reds' HC'.
Maybe the QRU put one of these in the Ballymore Carpark and looked at it for their 'global search':

91J-YkAEJ5L._SL1500_.jpg
 

RedsHappy

Tony Shaw (54)
Dude you need to get over it. What’s done is done.

You really believed that world wide coaching search bullshit the reds gave us fans? When have the reds ever hired a coach from outside of Australia?

I understand your frustration mate with how this season has gone but fact is we did not have the money for a external head coach (still paying off the previous failures in Stiles) hence why our HC was promoted internally & nor did we have a full offseason to do a coaching search because the decision to move to Thorn happened in October.

No fucking way do I 'need to get over it'. The continuing destruction of large tracts of QLD rugby is never something to 'get over' in any sense.

My frustration has little to do with 'this season', it has to do with a hatred of arrogant, self-centred, uncured and ongoing incompetence at the heart of QLD rugby THAT IS CATEGORICALLY DESTROYING SOMETHING - PERHAPS IRREVOCABLY - THAT I MANY OF MY CLOSE FRIENDS AND FAMILY LOVE AND DEEPLY ENJOY AND NOT WANT TO SEE DIE!

So there.

Finally, the notion that 'there was no money' for an HC like Lancaster is just rubbish. Another limp-waisted, intellectually vapid excuse perpetrated not by you but by the excusers and apologists that are both symptoms and perpetrators of the deathly mediocrity we see.

Why is it rubbish? One, anybody with half a rugby brain knows that there is NOTHING more important to elite, pro rugby than great coaching in depth. That capability is THE highest expenditure priority in a pro RU. Two, where has the QRU 'invested' fucking wanton truckloads of cash?, let me tell you: eg QC (Quade Cooper), Hunt, Smith. That's where large tracts of the QRU's wealth has gone: idiotic contracts driven by an equally idiotic notion that 'prestige' players were/are more important than world-class coaches. Cull or materiallly reduce those contracts and their ilk and I am certain you'd free up the $AX00,000 you'd need to pay a Lancaster over a Thorn.

Finally, the ultimate stupidity is to somehow believe that 'saving money on a 'cheap' Thorn' is anything other a near certain recipe for high business risk and rugby self-destruction in a comp as highly skilled and competitive overall as is Super Rugby.

The QRU would be way better off borrowing another say $400,000 pa if that's what a terrific HC needed or needs to come to the Reds than 'saving money' on a Thorn or Stiles that risked destroying - through terrible Reds performances - the QRU's gate and/or sponsorship income where that income is clearly in the $X,000,000s and can positively transform the viability of the code in QLD (as the outlier but great years of 2010-12 proved so handsomely in almost every respect).
 

SouthernX

John Thornett (49)
Reds Happy I feel 99% of your gripe when it comes to the incompetence of the Reds management but your anger at the coaches this season does not jive with me. Fact is Thorn is here now & beyond (and it’s the one move I actually applaude the big wigs making because Thorn as a rookie HC has shown more promise then the old head in a Stiles)

I’ve disagreed with you before on the AC but have mentioned that I am ok with upgrading Carozza/McGahan in 2019.... but to put the blame on these 2 men when they too were 11th hour hires is wrong. Sure they might be out of their depth but in terms of Carozza... well he has shown a lot of promise in the u20 academy and it was either going to now or never for him to get a bite at super rugby & unfortunately looks like he may be best suited going back to his old job.

Btw thanks for clarifying reds happy. Have mistaken your comments as 2018 in a single season vacuum where these QRU problems go back many years!
 

Gnostic

Mark Ella (57)
Fact is for every Graham, Stiles and Thorn it is not just wasted cash. It is wasted opportunity and TIME. Time is a very big factor in Australian Rugby now.

I said when Thorn was first proposed as a Reds coach on the rumour mill that I hoped it was not the case. He needed time to develop as a coach and not walk into the top job without earning it as a coach. And no doing two years in a two bit nothing of a competition like the NRC, especially when he did not earn that position by doing the hard yards supporting grass roots coaching, is not earning the position. Much the same can be said for Larkham so I am not being Reds centric with these comments.

I'd also point out the fundamental skills deficit in our pro players will not be solved by essentially amateur coaches learning their trade at Pro level.

So Thorn is there for the foreseeable future trotting out the completely false "we are a young side" lie. Better get used to results like last weekend, and I am not being dismissive of the Sunwolves who I thought played some great Rugby, but the Reds were woeful.
 

Gnostic

Mark Ella (57)
Dude you need to get over it. What’s done is done.



You really believed that world wide coaching search bullshit the reds gave us fans? When have the reds ever hired a coach from outside of Australia?



I understand your frustration mate with how this season has gone but fact is we did not have the money for a external head coach (still paying off the previous failures in Stiles) hence why our HC was promoted internally & nor did we have a full offseason to do a coaching search because the decision to move to Thorn happened in October.


This part in particular infuriates me. The board and executive have a fundamental duty and responsibility to be truthful and forthright in the information they present. I do not believe a word they say, like bankers, politicians and Lawyers you know they are lying when their lips move, but that doesn't mean we should expect them to aspire to such lofty ideals such as telling the truth and actually trying to act in an impartial manner for the betterment of the game.
 

Tomikin

David Codey (61)
Fact is for every Graham, Stiles and Thorn it is not just wasted cash. It is wasted opportunity and TIME. Time is a very big factor in Australian Rugby now.

I said when Thorn was first proposed as a Reds coach on the rumour mill that I hoped it was not the case. He needed time to develop as a coach and not walk into the top job without earning it as a coach. And no doing two years in a two bit nothing of a competition like the NRC, especially when he did not earn that position by doing the hard yards supporting grass roots coaching, is not earning the position. Much the same can be said for Larkham so I am not being Reds centric with these comments.

I'd also point out the fundamental skills deficit in our pro players will not be solved by essentially amateur coaches learning their trade at Pro level.

So Thorn is there for the foreseeable future trotting out the completely false "we are a young side" lie. Better get used to results like last weekend, and I am not being dismissive of the Sunwolves who I thought played some great Rugby, but the Reds were woeful.
Didn't Larkham at least coach in Japan for few years then was assistant to Jake White a few and then his first year had Fisher as a director of rugby..

Sent from my HTC 2PS6200 using Tapatalk
 

Gnostic

Mark Ella (57)
Didn't Larkham at least coach in Japan for few years then was assistant to Jake White a few and then his first year had Fisher as a director of rugby..



Sent from my HTC 2PS6200 using Tapatalk



From memory and a quick search he played out his career in Japan for Ricoh but his first coaching gig was at the Brumbies in 2010. No previous experience. Happy to be corrected.
 

Beer Baron

Phil Hardcastle (33)
What's the record for lateness of Match Thread being started.... IF i could be bothered, I would check but I reckon round 4,5 were up by Monday.
 

Zero_Cool

Arch Winning (36)
No team list yet???

Are we waiting on injuries or is Thorn just playing silly buggers??
Clearly Thorn is planning some mighty ducks esqu transformation where they bring Quade into the side. The Reds then go unbeaten the rest of the season and win 2018 Super Rugby!

And Quade leads the Wallabies to a Bledisloe Cup win!
 

Brumby Runner

Jason Little (69)
This part in particular infuriates me. The board and executive have a fundamental duty and responsibility to be truthful and forthright in the information they present. I do not believe a word they say, like bankers, politicians and Lawyers you know they are lying when their lips move, but that doesn't mean we should expect them to aspire to such lofty ideals such as telling the truth and actually trying to act in an impartial manner for the betterment of the game.

Not rugby related, but interesting to observe used car salesmen now rank below bankers, politicians, lawyers and coaches as men or women lacking in integrity.
 
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