Reds 2017

[RugbyReg]

The Samoan government tipped in some cash, though they don't seem to be saying how much.

This is from a Stuff.co.nz article:



So I'm assuming that the travel/accomodation costs were probably covered by the government, and the social media posts are probably payment in kind.

it was an away game. The travel and accommodation were always going to be covered.

I am sure the Reds got some sort of payment but I don't for a second the postings of the players are in anyway related to that.

Anyway, it's not that big an issue to dominate this discussion. I just think it's a poor look.

 

[RugbyReg]

It seems they are doing some training.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Bit of Samoan Government support is great.
Australia assists the Samoan people as follows:
2017-18 Total Australian ODA Estimate
$37.2 million

 

[Sauron]

Bit of Samoan Government support is great.
Australia assists the Samoan people as follows:
2017-18 Total Australian ODA Estimate
$37.2 million

What has that got to do with the price of fish?


Hahahahaha

 

[The torpedo]

This stuff is akin to the plain clothes fiasco in 2007, except at least that was after the season.

What was this?

 

[RugbyReg]

What was this?

the Reds returned to Brisbane after that 90 thrashing by the Bulls wearing civies and looking an absolute rabble.

 

[Ruggo]

Bunch of prawns this mob. Heads full of crap and no inkling of common sense that would dictate that they should be discrete. So easy for a few wankers to take things out of context but yet they still blindly expose themselves to that risk. Just plain silly is all I can say about that.

People will always stuff up and players are no different but where has the professional standard gone? Expectation seems to be pretty low these days.

I guess I think different but if I was underperforming in my job, I wouldn't want to be seen like I don't care and am on a holiday.

I would like to think one of the senior players gave these blokes a clip around the ear for this and simply say "pull your heads in fella's and be a bit wiser".

 

[Scrubber2050]

^^^^^^
I certainly don't think the captain is capable of doing that.

 

[bloodred]

RugbyReg said "I assume that's for Sunnybank? Did he come on for Jake Strachan? He is someone I'm very keen to see develop. Good playmaker and big boot."

Yes it was Reg, I'm not 100% on this but I think he started at 12, and finished the game at 10 when Strachan went off. Scrubber reckons he went well

 

[bloodred]

I agree withe posters on here that while they should be able to take in the highlights of the tour (this is Rugby after all), they should be aware of the difficult environment they have found themselves in (of their own doing). Management should have whispered in their ear

 

[Lee Enfield]

The problem is they didn't get it right and now look like fu(kwits, wearing boardies and standing in a pool.........This is how it is done;

 

[RedsHappy]

I agree withe posters on here that while they should be able to take in the highlights of the tour (this is Rugby after all), they should be aware of the difficult environment they have found themselves in (of their own doing). Management should have whispered in their ear

The sad thing is: we may care here, but so many people in Brisbane who used to follow and be interested in the Reds have given up, have walked away, no longer want to discuss them, don't care any more.

For how many years now has their affection and motivation been let down and abused by a QRU that cares more about its own than about us, and about 'them' out there who took shining pride from two or three glorious years before the old inner network took back control once again and began ruination anew.

 

[chasmac]

Its a fine line.
There wouldn't be a problem if they were winning.
Supporters need to adjust their expectations.
There is most definitely a coaching issue in your team.
Have the senior players undermined a good coach or is the coach out of his depth?

 

[amirite]

The sad thing is: we may care here, but so many people in Brisbane who used to follow and be interested in the Reds have given up, have walked away, no longer want to discuss them, don't care any more.

For how many years now has their affection and motivation been let down and abused by a QRU that cares more about its own than about us, and about 'them' out there who took shining pride from two or three glorious years before the old inner network took back control once again and began ruination anew.

You can paint the image of a fanbase scorned easily, and you would not be inaccurate. But, the fact is if the Reds had 2 good years in a row, played attractive football, and had 2-3 top flight Wallabies, those fans would be back. Anecdotally you may feel otherwise, but the research is telling.

All sporting organisations have dormant fan bases for when they're playing well, the issue rugby union has is they need those fair weather fans every year to actually turn a profit. And no team is good every year.

 

[Thinker]

Ready hasn't been good enough for a matchday spot for months but now jumps Mafi? Pickle has been out of form for a few years now but Tuttle constantly in and out and back in all season?

It's worse than we could have imagined.

 

[RedsHappy]

You can paint the image of a fanbase scorned easily, and you would not be inaccurate. But, the fact is if the Reds had 2 good years in a row, played attractive football, and had 2-3 top flight Wallabies, those fans would be back. Anecdotally you may feel otherwise, but the research is telling.

All sporting organisations have dormant fan bases for when they're playing well, the issue rugby union has is they need those fair weather fans every year to actually turn a profit. And no team is good every year.

I do get your drift but personally don't like these tags like 'fair weather', 'easily scorned'.

Probably not your intent, but I think these talk down to real fans who once paid good money (and many times) to see the Reds and today possess quite a real sense that they have not so much just been let down, but in fact more painfully cheated on by repetitive, uncured failure and with zero sense that things will change.

The mass disillusionment of thousands of Reds fans did not come from just some sort of sudden Reds collapse into producing less that stellar game outcomes, rather it has come from now many years of QRU/Reds preceding hype each season re 'great new recruits', 'exciting new players', 'support what's gonna be a great season and newly refreshed team ahead' etc etc only to ALWAYS be followed by more or less relentless mediocrity, awful play, lot of home losses, low skill levels, over-hyped new players and much related.

And no one really taking responsibility and accountability for it all. 'Major outside review of the QRU HPU' led to............RG reappointed and more jobs internally for ex-Wallbies and the insider mates...........the 'great external world-wide search for a new HC and more' led to.........a promotion of a previous local co-HC who'd achieved little plus a bunch of local rookie Assistants and who've all gone on to achieve little producing a _fifth_ consecutive season of gross underperformance and mediocrity.

Why should paying fans put up with this? Well, they haven't and we now have crisis-level, record low Reds' crowds of high single digit '000s at Suncorp.

Clyne frets about his interminable cull of the Force, but actually in hard truth, a far more serious problem has built up at Ballymore as a supposed one of two 'heartland' rugby centres in this country. He never mentions it, but he avoids its face at his and the ARU's peril.

The latent or obvious crises within Australian rugby are now multiple and simultaneous and this high-risk condition has never occurred before in the pro era.

 

[amirite]

I do get your drift but personally don't like these tags like 'fair weather', 'easily scorned'.

Probably not your intent,

Mate, you are correct that isn't my intent because you're quoting me but you're taking me pretty far out of context. Also, one is an out and out misquote with vital context removed and words rearranged.

"Rugby union needs those fair weather fans every year to actually turn a profit" is talking about fan engagement and sporting economics, not shitting on passionate supporters who've spent money. Nor is saying "You can paint the image of a fanbase scorned easily", which means it's easy to lay down the case for a pissed off fanbase, saying the fanbase is "easily scorned".

I'm discussing sporting economics, they're finding the same thing with Richmond and Carlton in the AFL. These are huge, traditional Victorian clubs who're seeing their membership and attendances rise and fall dramatically based on performance.

This is due to 'fan engagement', everyone likes a winner. Those fans that drift away tend to come back with good consistent wins.

 

[RedsHappy]

Mate, you are correct that isn't my intent because you're quoting me but you're taking me pretty far out of context. Also, one is an out and out misquote with vital context removed and words rearranged.

"Rugby union needs those fair weather fans every year to actually turn a profit" is talking about fan engagement and sporting economics, not shitting on passionate supporters who've spent money. Nor is saying "You can paint the image of a fanbase scorned easily", which means it's easy to lay down the case for a pissed off fanbase, saying the fanbase is "easily scorned".

I'm discussing sporting economics, they're finding the same thing with Richmond and Carlton in the AFL. These are huge, traditional Victorian clubs who're seeing their membership and attendances rise and fall dramatically based on performance.

This is due to 'fan engagement', everyone likes a winner. Those fans that drift away tend to come back with good consistent wins.

Overall, I very much agree with you - winning more than losing in Aus pro sports tends to correlate closely with positive income economics for the code, or club within the code, concerned.

This is one of the many reasons I am deeply concerned as to what the poor performance of our Super teams is doing to crowd levels and Foxtel viewership and the resulting consequences for the ARU's aggregated financial situation as it will unfold in 2017-8 if multiple State RU bail-outs and/or increased subsidies are required (which I suspect they will be). The fact that this is occurring simultaneously across all State RUs, and Super crowd levels have hit such common lows, is unprecedented (to my recollection anyway).

Re your point about the fans that leave coming back when good wins return etc.

I think you may find that this has actually not occurred on a long trend line basis with regards to a core club like the Tahs in Sydney.

Crowds built in 2013 and 2014 and into early 2015 with the Cheika successes there but nonetheless have (a) not been sustained and (b) even the peak return crowds of 2014 did not IIRC replicate the Tahs crowd levels of say the late 1990s/early 2000s. The Link/Hickey/Foley years of relatively dour, defensive Tahs play seem to have permanently dislodged a major chunk of what were reasonably consistent Tahs fans, but in some big chunks of '000s, they just never came back to the pro rugby game, seemingly gone forever.

 

[Thinker]

While I'm one of the suckers who keep paying year in year out and going to every game, I think any Reds fan have every right to walk away from the team.

It probably suggests intelligence rather than fickleness in support.

Remember when we pined to get rid of Carmichael, McCall and Graham? No one could have predicted you could find 3 less competent people in each role, but they did. Probably the biggest accomplishment in the last 4 years.

The losing isn't the problem for most (although Reds fans have always supported winner more, they will fill Suncorp winning 6-3 every week vs losing 45-43), the problem is that the organisation doesn't even try.

The Reds are at the point where the only thing that excites the crowd is the occasional try and the opportunity to pile on Frisby every time he box kicks.

I highly doubt Stiles will get the chop. Maybe he will re-discover his "passion"
for QLD and resign, but the presence of Stiles or any of these assistants next year means no finals football in 2018.

It's hard as a rugby fan, with everything else competing for your dollars, it's hard to say "sure, I'll buy memberships for my family" knowing full well that you'll be watching your beloved team lose each week in an empty stadium.

Paying $70 a match to watch the slop we are forced to endure is a big ask for anyone.

Fans are not owed results. That's part of sports. They are however, owed hope. You lay down your money and get the chance to see your team play and hopefully win, not get pumped by that Force team.

 

[Hound]

Thinker Agree we turn up each game to see a competitive team. If they lose but have had a decent crack I can live with that. Its when they get pumped and the player look as if they have no idea then are issues.
Reds are playing as individuals for 80% of their games. Every so often thay put it together and look like a team. Yes I will purcahse my membership again next year.