Ireland NZ Tour 2022

[waiopehu oldboy]

Nothing official yet but back in March NZR indicated that the three Tests will be in Auckland, Wellington & Dunedin on July 2, 9 & 16. I also saw it reported that Ireland were keen to play NZ Maori & perhaps one or two mid-weekers v Provincial Unions etc.

World Rugby have now appointed the match officials:

T1 Ref Karl Dickson; AR's Wayne Barnes & Jordan Way; TMO Tom Foley.

T2 Jaco Peyper; Dickson & Way; Marius van Der Westhuizen.

T3 Barnes; Dickson & Christophe Ridley; Foley.

Full list of appointments for June/ July Test Window here:

Match Officials Appointments | World Rugby

World Rugby match official appointments for international matches and tournaments.

www.world.rugby

 

[Dismal Pillock]

Used to be I'd sit arse-clenched and exasperated through the excruciating Loss Bleus season only for it to end and then suddenly I get to be a fan of the team that kicked everyone's arse, the goddamn murderous unstoppable thrilling All Blacks of New Zealand.

Well thats been flipped on its head hasnt it ffs.

Now it's the Blues season where the victorious jubilation lies, bathing in the glory of their crushing heroic deeds..... and dreading the end of that and the beginning of the All Blacks season. Bullshit selections of players I actively and vociferously dislike chosen by a sham of a coach and his hand-appointed gravy-training lackeys who I have ZERO CONFIDENCE in to innovate their way to success. In fact I fully expect this test season to be deeply, deeply embarrassing once chickenshit company man Fozzie goes with his safe failures of yesteryear.

TL/DR;FMLFFSWFT.

 

[Dan54]

So who else has plans of going to tests?

 

[Jeffrey]

Going to be such a critical test for the ABs.
The Irish were really good this year. They thumped England Scotland and Wales, and lost by 6 points to France; not one of the France's best games of late, but nonetheless France is probably the best team in the world right now.

At the back-end of the 6 Nations, they looked like a team that NZ wants to be - very quick ball, very crisp alignment, good set-piece. But they are arguably better than us right now because they can generate the quick-ball through their big ball-runners, and their defensive line with Andy Farrell at the helm is fast and aggressive. We probably just about edge the X-factor in the backs with Jordan, either Barret or Mouanga, and Reiko enjoying a decent patch of form.

They have quality throughout - massive front-rowers, absolutely massive; combined with Doris, Conan and Van Der Flier in the backrow, will be a good test of our defence which has struggled against the big boys since 2019. Would be nice for Lowe and Jamison Gibson-Park to be back in NZ. I hope Keenan travels too, he's class in the air, and I am not convinced Will Jordan gets tested enough at Super Level.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Dates confirmed as 2, 9 & 16 July but slight change to venues: T1 Eden Park, T2 Forsyth Barr, T3 Sky.

 

[Dismal Pillock]

Fozzie will pick Cane at 7 and Ardie at 8. No matter their form or how well any other prick plays. He will trust them to get it right on the night.

But Papalii is unavoidably good. Therefore I reckon Fozzie'll go:

6 Papalii (tight)
7 Cane (tight)
8 Ardie (loose)

 

[Dan54]

I bloody hope Canes is 7, he has been best one in NZ super this year. Papali'i has had one blinder , but was outplayed by Cane in head to head, and generally Cane has been better. I would be keen to see Papali'i run at 6 for part of a match, but on form in Super Frizell has been bloody good at 6, he's injured so opens a place , Akira will have time to pick up the spot, but Luke Jacobson has made a bloody good start too.

 

[Dan54]

Dates confirmed as 2, 9 & 16 July but slight change to venues: T1 Eden Park, T2 Forsyth Barr, T3 Sky.

Just seen the venues change WOB, maybe have to reconsider going to Wellington for the show I wanted on 7-07 and then stay down for test, just go down the next week

 

[zer0]

I bloody hope Canes is 7, he has been best one in NZ super this year. Papali'i has had one blinder , but was outplayed by Cane in head to head, and generally Cane has been better.

He most definitely was not outplayed in their most recent clash when the Blues defeated the Chiefs 25-0.

 

[Hawko]

Fozzie will pick Cane at 7 and Ardie at 8. No matter their form or how well any other prick plays. He will trust them to get it right on the night.

But Papalii is unavoidably good. Therefore I reckon Fozzie'll go:

6 Papalii (tight)
7 Cane (tight)
8 Ardie (loose)

I thought that Ardie basically got the win against the Reds on his own; he was immense. Maybe he should play 6 with a big bopper 8 but for me he's an automatic NZ selection wherever he plays.

 

[Dctarget]

What happened to Sotutu? I thought he was on track to make the #8 jersey his own.

 

[Dan54]

He most definitely was not outplayed in their most recent clash when the Blues defeated the Chiefs 25-0.

Really, he was first game, and they pretty par second game. Hell Dalton could well be building into season, but he won't get Cane's spot, he has been bloody good. That is not knocking Dalton either, just Cane is playing more like we want a test 7 I think.

 

[Dan54]

I thought that Ardie basically got the win against the Reds on his own; he was immense. Maybe he should play 6 with a big bopper 8 but for me he's an automatic NZ selection wherever he plays.

For sure he certainly best player in super so far this season. Also we don't have a big bopper in NZ at 8. I think Dalton is close to biggest loose forward in NZ, maybe a fraction in it with Akira.

 

[KiwiM]

What happened to Sotutu? I thought he was on track to make the #8 jersey his own.

He's playing well - with Ardie at 8 for the ABs he simply hasn't got many chances and he fluffed one of his earlier chances last season (one of the Fiji tests from memory he was poor). He did look really good off the bench in the win vs the Boks though - think that could be his role in rotation with Akira (who was good off the bench vs Ireland) - bench impact.

 

[KiwiM]

but on form in Super Frizell has been bloody good at 6,

Two things.

1). Frizell season after season has shown his Super form simply doesn't translate to test rugby.

2) Against the Crusaders ESPN had him down as making 6 tackles and missing 6 tackles. For all his ball running prowess defence like that is weak.

Frizell goes to the back of the queue.

There's no obvious answer at 6 right now but that doesn't mean you chew up valuable tests giving Frizell test minutes that could be going to someone else (Papali'i, Blackadder, Jacobson etc).

 

[Dan54]

Two things.

1). Frizell season after season has shown his Super form simply doesn't translate to test rugby.

2) Against the Crusaders ESPN had him down as making 6 tackles and missing 6 tackles. For all his ball running prowess defence like that is weak.

Frizell goes to the back of the queue.

There's no obvious answer at 6 right now but that doesn't mean you chew up valuable tests giving Frizell test minutes that could be going to someone else (Papali'i, Blackadder, Jacobson etc).

Ok, well I have never looked at ESPN stats to see who I think should be in ABs, I would be very very surprised and disgusted if any selector did. But regardless he was the best 6 in Super this year, and playing the best I have seen him play.

 

[KiwiM]

Ok, well I have never looked at ESPN stats to see who I think should be in ABs, I would be very very surprised and disgusted if any selector did. But regardless he was the best 6 in Super this year, and playing the best I have seen him play.

I watched that game and noticed Frizell missing a lot of tackles and went to the stats and it re-affirmed my thoughts. Alternatively I remember Blackadder making a heap of tackles to deny the Highlanders again and again and the stats backed that up too (24 made tackles. 1 missed).

 

[Jeffrey]

Dalton 6, Cane 7, Ardie 8
Won't work I think.

The first issue is size. Ardie carries well, but Cane and Papali'i don't, not at the highest level. Carrying is really important because the other forwards are all pretty shite at it. Moody, Taylor, Laulala, Retallick, Whitelock are all not great ball carriers - a mixture of too skinny or too slow.
Papali'i for all his merits (he's a great prospect) is not a dominant physical presence.

The next issue is lineout; none of the 3 are really good jumpers. Cane isn't. Ardie is slightly better. Dalton is possibly the best, but they are not as good as Akira, Hoskins, (who is really, really good at lineout) Frizell, or Ethan. Lineouts are really crucial - a little more than 40% of international tries come directly from lineout, and every team has a sizeable backrow.

Take Ireland for example - Doris and Conan are 193-194. Alldritt (has been a reliable jumper for years), Cros, and Jelonch are all 1.9+ (and Jelonch is very good at lineout). For England, Lawes has been playing at 6, while Dombrandt is probably their best 8 and he's pushing 195.

For all of our loose forwards' industry, we really lack a Kaino. A big bopper who bends the line, wants to and actually smashes people, and is good at the lineout. Why is there no space for such a big bopper in 5 Kiwi teams? Even the Aussies have a few now, with Leota and Valetini. Everyone is all about fitness and good hands, running tram lines and offloads - very nice but surely lacking a few personalities who just love the physical side of the game - every other country has a few of those.

 

[KiwiM]

Dalton 6, Cane 7, Ardie 8
Won't work I think.

The first issue is size. Ardie carries well, but Cane and Papali'i don't, not at the highest level. Carrying is really important because the other forwards are all pretty shite at it. Moody, Taylor, Laulala, Retallick, Whitelock are all not great ball carriers - a mixture of too skinny or too slow.
Papali'i for all his merits (he's a great prospect) is not a dominant physical presence.

Take Ireland for example - Doris and Conan are 193-194. Alldritt (has been a reliable jumper for years), Cros, and Jelonch are all 1.9+ (and Jelonch is very good at lineout). For England, Lawes has been playing at 6, while Dombrandt is probably their best 8 and he's pushing 195.

For all of our loose forwards' industry, we really lack a Kaino. A big bopper who bends the line, wants to and actually smashes people, and is good at the lineout. Why is there no space for such a big bopper in 5 Kiwi teams?

Great post.

Dalton is bigger than people realise. He's 193cm and 113kg.

As for the ball running - that's why Samisoni should be the starting hooker - his ball running is elite.

It might not work as with the reasons you suggest above but to me it's worth a shot given there's no answer at 6.

My main issue with it is Cane and Papali'i get injured a lot.

The two best defensive tackling loosies are Cane and Papali'i - starting both might bring some starch to the defensive which is badly needed.

 

[Dismal Pillock]

Ardie carries well, but Cane and Papali'i don't, not at the highest level.