Bledisloe 2 at Eden Park 18/10/20

[Dctarget]

Many will disagree, but I thought FF (Folau Fainga'a) was below where he needed to be across for more than just line-out throws, and this has been the case in his previous test starts. He has certainly been the best 2 in super rugby, but at this stage doesn't seem to make the step up. I would have Uelese start next test. I would give Thor another start, he did a lot of good things, but two careless penalties at the breakdown comes from a drop in concentration, he needs to do better. AAA made a very good case for starting when he came on, so I think TT is on notice. In the backrow, I would start Wright at 6, move Wilson to 8, have Samu off the bench and leave Valetini out of the 22.
In the backs, I was really pissed off with To'omua kicking our attacking opportunities away, and that must stop. Having said that, I think he remains our best option at 12 so wouldn't make a change. If Petaia returns, he goes to 13, Paisami to the bench (tough I know, but we need our best 15 guys on the paddock). Lolesio drops out, I think he's a great talent and I want to see him start at 10 this season. but there is no point having him on the bench if we aren't going to use him, it's a 23 man game. If JOC (James O'Connor) goes down, To'omua can always move to 10.
By the way, I don't think it was so much players not getting to the breakdown was our problem as inaccuracy at the cleanout by the first man there. That has to be better.
And Rob Simmons, that was just too dumb. The ref is screaming at number 19, we are 3 in front and 20 metres out, WTF! Time to go. Either take the punt and put Hosea on the bench, or if the lineout really is why Simmons was there, put Hanigan on the bench.

Agree with all this. FF (Folau Fainga'a) had that awful fumble on the loop around the lineout hot on attack deep in NZ's half. If Uelese did that and had FF (Folau Fainga'a)'s poor throws people would say he should never be in gold again.

 

[dru]

Part of the purpose of the bench is to cover for potential injuries. The fact that Chris Whitaker rarely got off the bench wouldn't have justified not carrying a reserve 9.

Apples and oranges. JOC (James O'Connor) and a To'omua are a back up to 10. TBH I’m a fan of arranging experience for up and coming 10s when our starter may not be long term simply due to age. (Same thing with JOC (James O'Connor) at the Reds). But when the whole team was off it’s feet by the final whistle I don’t think we can afford a “what if” on the bench - especially when there is already an answer on the field.

it was a difficult game for fullbacks. I'm not sure what benchmark you are using for 'international fullback', but Banks was assured under the highball, kicked well and outplayed his opposite number.

Outplaying McKenzie in that game is a low bar. I don’t see Banks advantage over Hodge. Who is not necessarily his closest competitor. His first half had rough edges for me, his second improved. Give him time and we’ll see. He does deserve more time I grant you that.

 

[fatprop]

I would let these guys have another go, they deserve it

Petaia maybe the only change, but Hunter did good and deserves another go

 

[Braveheart81]

Samu certainly didn't have the impact playing a more central role like he normally does on the edge. Wilson did have that impact on the edge and his offload game worked well.

I think we'll keep the same backrow for this weekend but it will be one to watch.

 

[Zero_Cool]

Yeah no way Lolesio starts. MAYBE he's retained on the bench because of positional flexibility but he's likely surplus given Hodge/O'Connor/To'omua can all play basically everywhere in the backline. I'd almost expect us to go a 6/2 split to help deal with the NZ on-ballers. Obviously with the perennial 23 Reece Hodge retaining his jersey. If we go 5/3 then I'd retain Hunter because he's 'proven' and doesn't know how to not go HARD, but I think 6/2 is the best option for game 2. We've got 3 guys who can cover basically the whole backline so versatility is unnecessary.

I be tempted to move Samu to the bench for the more robust Wright and probably think about McReight coming onto the bench (for Valetini who'd be a bit hard done by but just not the right fit for this opposition) if they go a 6/2. Rob 'dumb penalties' Simmons gets banished to the training paddock for the rest of time and we bring in Hosea to the bench. FF (Folau Fainga'a) is probably safe for now as nether Hooker was outstanding but I think the concerns about FF (Folau Fainga'a)'s throwing are a little over blown. (Wind pun but not a fart joke!)

I think we've got to do more to slow down the Kiwi ball and deal with their onballers and Wright is probably that answer.
I'd love to see Tate coming in to close out the game but White & Gordon were very good.

 

[Viking]

Anyone suggesting to drop To'omua, are they actually serious?? He played a solid 12 game, been the conduit between 9/10 and the outside backs, who saw plenty of ball. Defensively he was great. Some people are determined to look for things that simply aren't there to justify perception heading into the game.

Well said. I think poor chip kicks set an immediate precedent for a poor game given the history of poor kicking in the wallabies. Much like like a few poor box kicks.

To be fair, To'omua has a smart rugby mind. He always seems to do a kick behind the defensive line early in the game to keep the defence guessing from early on. I like this idea - even if the execution is average.

One of this kicks later in the match was also under advantage so that was nothing lost there (although the wobs do seem to kick away advantage too often).

So I give him a pass for these kicks, then I think he had 1 or 2 other kicks behind the line which were poor options.

 

[Viking]

it was a difficult game for fullbacks. I'm not sure what benchmark you are using for 'international fullback', but Banks was assured under the highball, kicked well and outplayed his opposite number.

Agree, Banks was absolutely solid at the back which is exactly what you want in those conditions. Deserves to keep his spot.

Although he really isn't offering much on attack which needs to improve. Would love to see more of his inside lines.

 

[Viking]

Samu certainly didn't have the impact playing a more central role like he normally does on the edge. Wilson did have that impact on the edge and his offload game worked well.

I think we'll keep the same backrow for this weekend but it will be one to watch.

Samu was still solid with a few turnovers, and getting some tough run metres in tight with his footwork. A different Samu to Super Rugby as you mentioned.

Valetini was poor when he arrived I thought. Wouldn't mind seeing Liam Wright replace him on the bench or start Liam with Samu on the bench an option too. Might help the poor breakdown accuracy which Liam is a specialist at.

Would be pretty harsh on Samu if he was dropped though.

 

[RebelYell]

Unchanged 23 if possible.

 

[Braveheart81]

Valetini was poor when he arrived I thought. Wouldn't mind seeing Liam Wright replace him on the bench or start Liam with Samu on the bench an option too. Might help the poor breakdown accuracy which Liam is a specialist at.

Replacing one of our backrowers only really helps our attacking breakdown if the guy they're replacing is the one who was missing cleanouts.

More analysis needs to be done to work out what really went wrong there. Was it a structure problem of not re-aligning quick enough to support our ball carrier and thus we ended up isolated with no one nearby to clean out or were certain players missing cleanouts they should have made? I think it's a bit of both but would be interesting to understand the detail.

At least one or two were certainly poor choices by the ball carrier. E.g. when White got caught close to the All Blacks line he'd elected to go for a snipe where there was really no option and his support players were so close because it was right next to the previous ruck that they've got very little chance of making an effective cleanout because they have no run up to the ruck.

 

[Tex]

Valetini was very poor and would struggle to justify keeping a Naisarani out of the team, let alone out of the training squad. I think Paisami was impactful and should start again, especially if there's a flicker of doubt about Petaia's fitness. Lolesio stays on the bench.

 

[Brumbieman]

Play almost exactly the same team.

Simmons gets taken out back and shot, and maybe Petaia on the bench for Lolesio. Other than that, change nothing

 

[dru]

Regarding our concern with turn overs, it is worth considering within the whole game.

Turnovers conceded - New Zealand: 21
Turnovers conceded - Australia: 12

The penalty count indicates perhaps discipline was a bigger issue.

 

[Joe Blow]

I thought Banks started below par for an international. He grew into the game though. So it’s worth giving him time to continue that growth. He’s done enough in one game but I’m not calling him a must have by any measure.

He was great. Took every high ball well, made yards in traffic, secured the ball in the tackle and his positional play was excellent. He had limited opportunity in attack but we all know that he also has speed and a great swerve.
He aimed up I all the areas he was suspect before.
Looks like he was also very strong in the tackle.
He should be given a chance to make the position his own

 

[Zero_Cool]

Yeah, but those penalties were due to being isolated. We almost need a 'pilfer penalty' that gets counted differently or something.
I don't see Lolesio keeping his spot on the bench either Jordie or Hunter get his spot (unless his spot is eliminated due to 6/2 split).

I think we've gotta go a 6/2 split to deal with the AB's lose forwards - maybe 5/2 if we start Wright. He will give us that breakdown presence to help limit the AB's on ballers (and give us a lot more presence over the ball). It was really telling that in the closing stages of the game when we desperately needed a pilfer we had no one really who could get over the ball well.

 

[Dctarget]

I thought we managed to hide Koroibete from the high balls very well.

In that first half I watched NZ struggle with the high ball so much, the wind buffeted it back so it landed 15m away from where they'd expect. I was terrified when the halves were switched they'd do the same but nothing came of it. I was happily surprised by that.

 

[Try-ranosaurus Rex]

I think we've gotta go a 6/2 split to deal with the AB's lose forwards - maybe 5/2 if we start Wright.

You're going to discount our bench by a player if we play Wright?

I mean he's a good player, but not superman.

 

[Getwithme]

Hoping only change is Petaia in for Lolesio. Other potential changes include DHP for Banks but agree with the theme that he wasn't bad at all. Who is the next prop behind Sio?

 

[wamberal]

Hoping only change is Petaia in for Lolesio. Other potential changes include DHP for Banks but agree with the theme that he wasn't bad at all. Who is the next prop behind Sio?

I hope its Pone. I would love to see him and Tupou on the field together, rampaging through the opposition.

 

[Derpus]

Is Pone not also a TH?