Australian Schoolboys / Under 18s 2019
- Thread starter RugbyReg
- Start date
Dean Moriarty
Billy Sheehan (19)
http://www.rugby.com.au/news/2019/03/02/brumbies-rebels-academy
Game replay for those of you who are interested
Game replay for those of you who are interested
The Nomad
Bob Davidson (42)
Andrew is the DOR at Churchie, the GPS schools in Qld are not supporting the Schoolboys pathway up here, instead seem to be going with the Academy set up.
Might have something to do with that,
I play wing
Chris McKivat (8)
https://www.facebook.com/ausschoolsrugby/photos/a.320678712140614/331195277755624/?type=3&theater
According to the ASRU Facebook page he is the Assistant Coach this year. Full team management appointments are listed here too.
I play wing
Chris McKivat (8)
Official statement on the Aussie schools structure for 2019 - many of you probably have a good grasp of it but its fully explained here in a letter to the school principals
https://www.facebook.com/ausschoolsrugby/photos/a.320678712140614/335080304033788/?type=3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/ausschoolsrugby/photos/a.320678712140614/335080304033788/?type=3&theater
I play wing
Chris McKivat (8)
Full Queensland I & II lists here for those interested: https://www.facebook.com/ausschools...d=1557283945664738¬if_t=page_post_reaction
The Nomad
Bob Davidson (42)
In short , yes .
The GPS as a whole decided to put their support behind the Academy pathway, GT broke ranks of sort and didn’t stand in the way of students who wanted to trial. Not all of their top talent did trial .
The majority of the AIC comp supported it , with MCA the exception.
Oldschool
Jim Clark (26)
So if I've got this right. Qld 1 & 2 Schools will play in the school boy national champs in July for a barbars jersey.
The preordained academy boys (NSW & QLD) get to play 2 games over a March to September period. WA, Rebels and Brumbies to play one more over that period for some reason - maybe they need the practice.
Why aren't the barbars, aka the also rans from the national champs, playing the NSW & QLD academy boys to see if they are up to standard or not. Surely this would help Hewat to make the right selection choices and maybe emulate what the U20's did on the weekend. Or are the Academies so confident that they have already identified the talent in their regions that the 2 extra games would be a waste of resources and not to mention save a few potential blushes if they got rolled by some lads in their catchment.
The preordained academy boys (NSW & QLD) get to play 2 games over a March to September period. WA, Rebels and Brumbies to play one more over that period for some reason - maybe they need the practice.
Why aren't the barbars, aka the also rans from the national champs, playing the NSW & QLD academy boys to see if they are up to standard or not. Surely this would help Hewat to make the right selection choices and maybe emulate what the U20's did on the weekend. Or are the Academies so confident that they have already identified the talent in their regions that the 2 extra games would be a waste of resources and not to mention save a few potential blushes if they got rolled by some lads in their catchment.
The Nomad
Bob Davidson (42)
Not quite , it seems that Qld is the only state that hasn't been able to reach some sort of agreement between Schoolboys and Academy. NSW and Vic are including their Academy players in the Schoolboys teams that are headed to Riverview. After the National Champs they will announce teams to play home games in Sept against Samoa I think.
There is an Australian U18 ( & Schoolboys) team named after the Reds V Waratahs U18 game played at Ballymore towards the end of Sept that can effectively chose from any U18 lad playing rugby in the country. That team tours NZ in early Oct.
There is an Australian U18 ( & Schoolboys) team named after the Reds V Waratahs U18 game played at Ballymore towards the end of Sept that can effectively chose from any U18 lad playing rugby in the country. That team tours NZ in early Oct.
Dean Moriarty
Billy Sheehan (19)
So the theory would suggest Nomad. But practically, in Queensland, unless you were part of the show last year as a 17 year old that had their Schoolboy opportunity , or , 1 of 15 or so pre-ordained current 17 year old Academy participants you don't exist.
Oldschool hit the nail on the head . There are too many vested interests and not enough true independent resources for it not to be made to work as it should.
In the 90's Australia won two World Cups off the back of the strongest grassroots and club participation that had built over 20 years or so since the mid to late 70'. Co-incidence ?
Nup.Players had to cut it in Club first against men before they earned QLD call up. And what do you know Australia had a tonne of success without all the overlay of horse shit. The overlay of horse shit is basically manufactured excessive jobs with more segmenting and layering to justify existence. They won't admit it but these guys are almost obliged to make their 15 and 16 year old selections work and give them priority of opportunity despite what actually happens.
Too harsh ?
The results of "the new pathway" and it's evolvement over the last 7 years speaks for itself if sensitivities and bullshit are put to the side and the only thing that matters is results as an indicator as to whether your programs are working . So no real meaningful results against best in show , that being the Kiwis , at Schoolboy or U20 level . Senior level for that matter. And Australian Rugby continues to find new low points.
Oldschool hit the nail on the head . There are too many vested interests and not enough true independent resources for it not to be made to work as it should.
In the 90's Australia won two World Cups off the back of the strongest grassroots and club participation that had built over 20 years or so since the mid to late 70'. Co-incidence ?
Nup.Players had to cut it in Club first against men before they earned QLD call up. And what do you know Australia had a tonne of success without all the overlay of horse shit. The overlay of horse shit is basically manufactured excessive jobs with more segmenting and layering to justify existence. They won't admit it but these guys are almost obliged to make their 15 and 16 year old selections work and give them priority of opportunity despite what actually happens.
Too harsh ?
The results of "the new pathway" and it's evolvement over the last 7 years speaks for itself if sensitivities and bullshit are put to the side and the only thing that matters is results as an indicator as to whether your programs are working . So no real meaningful results against best in show , that being the Kiwis , at Schoolboy or U20 level . Senior level for that matter. And Australian Rugby continues to find new low points.
Chip kick
Allen Oxlade (6)
The letter sent to all schools seems to indicate that some kids have already been identified and are in the academies, they don't have to go to the National school comp in july. I wonder how many kids are from GPS,CAS and ISA schools in this system already. It seems if you made a rep team last year you're in. I ran into a sydney north SJRU team training last week they are also on a pathway to the schools comp, but first have to be picked out of the 4 conferences. I wonder how much talent just doesn't get to showcase their skills in this new system.
The Nomad
Bob Davidson (42)
Just won the U20 Oceania Champs against the Junior ABs , haven’t beaten the NZ U18s since 2012, hopefully being able to pick all available 18 year olds for Australia U18 rather than just those at school might break the drought , will find out come October. No system perfect, also remember it seems like Qld only have managed to really make a balls up of the new pathways.
Regarding the good old days of earning your stripes in clubland, couldn’t agree more . Unfortunately the professional era has mostly put an end to that, as I’m sure you realise , you need a contract to play professional rugby and there is a finite number of those available. Super rugby teams aren’t the rep teams of old . Many of the young kids coming through now see rugby as a career option and professional franchises are sort of forced to lock in a certain amount of talent to avoid it going elsewhere. Very different to the good old days, but what’s the alternative?
Dean Moriarty
Billy Sheehan (19)
Not knocking the boys who won last Saturday Night but what is that ? One win in 7 years. The "pathway" hasn't worked and there is zero justification to continue to segment and bolster it in financial sense and a glib sales sense to convince stakeholders of its merits,other than to keep self interested bums on seats at the administrative and operational level of the game.
You sort of also highlighted the fundamental issue in your reply. Where Rugby reacts in this idea that we can share athletes and compete with League. Consequently commitments are made very early and at least a third of the time to the wrong types for different reasons , but where those commitments continue to be justified. And where the filtering is dodgy as fuck. The war is over. League won. Wake up. Rather than homogenise with League , Rugby needs to get its balls back and be fiercely unapologetic about what it stands for which may mean rediscovering and promoting some of the old values that defined the game and why you play it. This was lost in a mismanagement of vision and identity in the emergence of the "new media" over the last 20 years .
We're not competing with League. We're niche. Always were and always will be. Get better at defining values and selling the value proposition , which at the moment , is completely absent and doesn't exist . Hence there is nothing to sell. And you need to have something to sell other than playing bucks and gladiatorial prestige. The stage is part of it but Rugby always was about life after and networks and careers and education and roundedness leading up to that . And this was , and still can be , rooted in community found in Clubs and upwards from there. We've thrown all that way in a race to the lowering mean with League
You sort of also highlighted the fundamental issue in your reply. Where Rugby reacts in this idea that we can share athletes and compete with League. Consequently commitments are made very early and at least a third of the time to the wrong types for different reasons , but where those commitments continue to be justified. And where the filtering is dodgy as fuck. The war is over. League won. Wake up. Rather than homogenise with League , Rugby needs to get its balls back and be fiercely unapologetic about what it stands for which may mean rediscovering and promoting some of the old values that defined the game and why you play it. This was lost in a mismanagement of vision and identity in the emergence of the "new media" over the last 20 years .
We're not competing with League. We're niche. Always were and always will be. Get better at defining values and selling the value proposition , which at the moment , is completely absent and doesn't exist . Hence there is nothing to sell. And you need to have something to sell other than playing bucks and gladiatorial prestige. The stage is part of it but Rugby always was about life after and networks and careers and education and roundedness leading up to that . And this was , and still can be , rooted in community found in Clubs and upwards from there. We've thrown all that way in a race to the lowering mean with League
The Nomad
Bob Davidson (42)
Do you really think the old Schoolboys system was not without politics or bias ?
If you want to go back to the amateur era , I agree with everything you have said . If you want niche , that was 20 years ago. All professional sports now compete with all other sports and all other forms of entertainment for that mater. I would love to wind back the clock for many reasons other than rugby , but that’s not happening. Remember you are preaching to the converted on a forum such as this .
If you want to go back to the amateur era , I agree with everything you have said . If you want niche , that was 20 years ago. All professional sports now compete with all other sports and all other forms of entertainment for that mater. I would love to wind back the clock for many reasons other than rugby , but that’s not happening. Remember you are preaching to the converted on a forum such as this .
Dean Moriarty
Billy Sheehan (19)
Of course. I was never extolling any virtue there.
No, I don't want to go back to the Amateur era. Clearly that is not possible. But I do believe in niche where small can be the new big . Yes there is competition for eyes on screens and bums on seats. But we're losing at the moment in what we think we have to be to compete and we lack true leadership across every level in the game that can't or won't reimagine our traditional values and make them relevant in the modern context in an effort to be proudly niche and differentiated . Which is the key to the space that you are trying to own.
The massive latent value in Clubs is a significant solution piece to the puzzle. The people on the ground have already spoken when you look at turnout rates and interest in Shute Shield and here in Premier Grade and then compare that to the piss poor crowds at Tahs and Reds games. The top end of the game is simply way too disconnected to its grassroots , from where , you will be able to build your values and your identity. Which like I said doesn't exist in any meaningful sense anymore.
No, I don't want to go back to the Amateur era. Clearly that is not possible. But I do believe in niche where small can be the new big . Yes there is competition for eyes on screens and bums on seats. But we're losing at the moment in what we think we have to be to compete and we lack true leadership across every level in the game that can't or won't reimagine our traditional values and make them relevant in the modern context in an effort to be proudly niche and differentiated . Which is the key to the space that you are trying to own.
The massive latent value in Clubs is a significant solution piece to the puzzle. The people on the ground have already spoken when you look at turnout rates and interest in Shute Shield and here in Premier Grade and then compare that to the piss poor crowds at Tahs and Reds games. The top end of the game is simply way too disconnected to its grassroots , from where , you will be able to build your values and your identity. Which like I said doesn't exist in any meaningful sense anymore.