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2012 Rugby Championship R5G1 Springbokke vs Wallabies @ the Bull Ring

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Inside Shoulder

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Loki74 said:
I have a feeling I saw an article a while back that essentially implied we could not drop out of the top 4 regardless of results. Would be good to know if that is correct. I am not entirely sure how the system works. It may be more about teams who have a chance of overtaking us having few games between now and the cut off. England aren't the threat. They are already 4th. The question would be if both England and say France could overtake us.
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http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/news/newsid=2063376.html
 
Inside Shoulder

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
No one mentioned that as a possible fallout prior to the game - not that there's much we cold have done about it.
I see sweden dropped a place as well.
 
L

Loki74

Ward Prentice (10)
Interesting. I just had a look on the IRB website as well. From what I can gather (it seems slightly complicated) each game involves teams playing for a points differential. It appears that home sides are given a handicap in terms of ratings - they are treated as if they are 3 rating points higher than their current rating. Which means for each of our games against England France and Wales, it will in effect be as if we are playing against teams rated higher than we are (based on the current ratings). Means they have less points on offer. Also depends on whether they put 15 or more points on us.
 
L

Loki74

Ward Prentice (10)
Jiggles said:
"We're Number 3! We're Number 3! We're Number 3!"
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To be honest, that seems pretty generous to us at the moment. A lot of people seem to have gotten overexcited about our ability to win by small margins at home. Seems to me that if we were anywhere near 2 in the world, then we would win most games at home comfortably (except against the ABs) and be winning a decent number of matches o/s by small margins. At the moment, we are barely able to put the no.8 side in the world away at home.
 
Schadenfreude

Schadenfreude

John Solomon (38)
Loki74 said:
Interesting. I just had a look on the IRB website as well. From what I can gather (it seems slightly complicated) each game involves teams playing for a points differential. It appears that home sides are given a handicap in terms of ratings - they are treated as if they are 3 rating points higher than their current rating. Which means for each of our games against England France and Wales, it will in effect be as if we are playing against teams rated higher than we are (based on the current ratings). Means they have less points on offer. Also depends on whether they put 15 or more points on us.
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And here's where the KPI kicks in. Defensive selections and tactics to "not lose by too much". I'm bored already.
 
en_force_er

en_force_er

Geoff Shaw (53)
Loki74 said:
I have a feeling I saw an article a while back that essentially implied we could not drop out of the top 4 regardless of results. Would be good to know if that is correct. I am not entirely sure how the system works. It may be more about teams who have a chance of overtaking us having few games between now and the cut off. England aren't the threat. They are already 4th. The question would be if both England and say France could overtake us.
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I wouldn't back Wales, they just can't beat the SH nations the way they can beat the NH ones.

France have shown nothing to suggest they will be top 4 material under their new regime just yet.

England have a huge amount of promise but they're rebuilding and I can't see them winning games consistently against the SH nations.

Us dropping out of the top 4 would take a colossal meltdown from us (above and beyond anything that's happening right now) and a huge rise in the stocks of 2 fringe nations.

Like I said, I'd be surprising but not impossible.
 
No4918

No4918

John Hipwell (52)
Can someone work out what happens this weekend if the Boks lose and we win? Being as losses at home and wins away create bigger point changes i am guessing we could be back at 2.
 
qwerty51

qwerty51

Stirling Mortlock (74)
No4918 said:
Can someone work out what happens this weekend if the Boks lose and we win? Being as losses at home and wins away create bigger point changes i am guessing we could be back at 2.
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If we win and they lose, we go back to #2.
 
kiap

kiap

Steve Williams (59)
We've probably seen the last of the 30 minute sub, anyway.
​
Wallabies got substitution wrong: IRB​
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October 3, 2012 - 9:32AM Paul Cully​
​
..... The Wallabies believed that Fainga'a should have been allowed on as another front-row option, but the governing body has ruled that Rolland was correct.​
​
“The referee was correct,” said the IRB's James Fitzgerald in response to an inquiry from the Fairfax. “Australia had already used their seven replacements permissible.” .....​
​
 
Dam0

Dam0

Dave Cowper (27)
To get everyone even more confused, I offer:

The IRB communique:


The IRB has confirmed that the match official team taking charge of Saturday's Rugby Championship between South Africa and Australia in Pretoria incorrectly prevented Australia from making a substitute during the second half of the match.
Following an initial review, the five-strong match official team acknowledges that they failed to recognise Law 3.12 (Exception 2) when managing a substitution in the 66th minute, which meant that Australia finished the match with 14 players.
Under the Law exception, Australia's Saia Fainga'a (16) should have been permitted to replace Australia's Tatafu Polota-Nau (2) as Benn Robinson (1), who had already been substituted, replaced Ben Alexander (3) who was injured during the match. Therefore, Australia had one permitted technical substitution available.
IRB Match Official Selection Committee Chairman John Jeffrey said: "The area of substitution management is a team effort. This was an unfortunate case of human error by the match officials who fully recognise and accept that they made a mistake in the application of the substitution Law."
"All match official performances, including last weekend's match, are thoroughly reviewed and assessed by the IRB and are considered when appointments are made for future Test matches."
Performances during The Rugby Championship will be reviewed at the IRB Match Official Selection Committee meeting in Johannesburg, South Africa this weekend.
Editors Notes:
Law 3.12 (Exception 2): a substituted player may replace a front row player when injured, temporarily suspended or sent off unless the referee has ordered uncontested scrums prior to the event which led to the front row player leaving the field of play and the team has used all the permitted replacements and substitutions.
Further information:
Dominic Rumbles, IRB Head of Communications, +353-868-520-826, email dominic.rumbles@irb.com
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SAReferee's opinion:

http://www.sareferees.com/laws/view/2829805/



I think it just goes to say that, like with economists, if you put 10 referees in a room and ask them for a decision, you are likely to get 10 different answers.
 
Lindommer

Lindommer

Simon Poidevin (60)
Staff member
Lindommer said:
.....a sideline lawyer may have been able to successfully argue Australia were allowed to run Fainga'a on under Laws 3.12, 3.13 and 3.14. As clear as mud.
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Looks like we'll have to keep a legal fella close on hand for occasions like this.
 
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