Wallabies 2025

[JRugby2]

The pick and drive needs to be varied with a short pass to another pod. That’s far harder to defend. The pick and go from halfback isn’t asking enough questions of the try line defence.

If executed - don't have stats to back up this assumption but guessing you're more likely to fumble the ball with a pass rather than pick and go. You also potentially sacrifice support at the break down if you have more players setting up a wider pod (increase risk of turnover).You have to time it right too - it takes longer to set up a pod then running from the base, also takes longer for the ball to get to the pod when you add a pass (defense can start advancing before the ball even reaches the pod) so you could sacrifice metres.

Personally, would guess that a pick and go and probably less risky and more likely to pay off (ie try/ penalty)

 

[Major Tom]

If executed - don't have stats to back up this assumption but guessing you're more likely to fumble the ball with a pass rather than pick and go. You also potentially sacrifice support at the break down if you have more players setting up a wider pod (increase risk of turnover).You have to time it right too - it takes longer to set up a pod then running from the base, also takes longer for the ball to get to the pod so you could sacrifice metres.

Personally, would guess that a pick and go and probably less risky and more likely to pay off (ie try/ penalty)

Mate, if you can’t catch a short pass that close to the line than you don’t deserve a try. I’m also not in favour of just that tactic. It’s about varying it. Which in the last few game we have not done. By passing to a another pod yes you risk them dropping the ball or being isolated, but you also force the defensive line to bite in on that potential ball carrier allowing the half back to pick and drive at a potential hole in defence. I don’t have a problem keeping it simple and hammering away in tight but just pick and diving ain’t gonna do it at this level.

 

[JRugby2]

Mate, if you can’t catch a short pass that close to the line than you don’t deserve a try. I’m also not in favour of just that tactic. It’s about varying it. Which in the last few game we have not done. By passing to a another pod yes you risk them dropping the ball or being isolated, but you also force the defensive line to bite in on that potential ball carrier allowing the half back to pick and drive at a potential hole in defence. I don’t have a problem keeping it simple and hammering away in tight but just pick and diving ain’t gonna do it at this level.

I broadly agree with what your saying - but as you acknowledge, a pass increases the risk you don't get and pay off (as does spinning it wide before you've caused a penalty).

You absolutely need to be able to execute both variations but side by side - hammering away is the lowest risk, highest rate of return and we have countless examples of it working for us at this level this year so I strongly disagree with that last bit.

Again I think we are really over analysing a poor showing and taking the wrong learnings from it. We fucked it on the weekend because some idiot tried to jump over the ruck. The tactic wasn't wrong, it was the in-the-moment decision making and poor execution that butchered the try.

 

[Dctarget]

What I don't get is that we finish within a score or two of the Lions, England, South Africa and New Zealand. Would Italy be able to do that?

 

[rugbyAU]

What I don't get is that we finish within a score or two of the Lions, England, South Africa and New Zealand. Would Italy be able to do that?

No way, Italy lost 45-0 and 42-24 to SA earlier this year and play them this week, last year lost by 20 to NZ and 80 at the WC and lost by 23 to England, last year they lost to Samoa who will be the 24th side to make the WC and lost by 30 to Arg

 

[wamberal99]

No way, Italy lost 45-0 and 42-24 to SA earlier this year and play them this week, last year lost by 20 to NZ and 80 at the WC and lost by 23 to England, last year they lost to Samoa who will be the 24th side to make the WC and lost by 30 to Arg

Unfortunately the Italians think they can beat us.

 

[Tomthumb]

What I don't get is that we finish within a score or two of the Lions, England, South Africa and New Zealand. Would Italy be able to do that?

No they wouldn’t, which is why it’s unacceptable to lose to them twice in a row

 

[Strewthcobber]

The team that played Italy, is not the team that played the Lions, England, South Africa and New Zealand.

For the second time in a row

 

[Spamnoodle]

Loathe it all you like - but its simply a percentage play inside the 5m as when done smartly the outcome is almost always try or penalty (in which you can spin it under advantage).

Spin it without that fail safe and the outcome can be a coin flip if the defense is good or the passes are shit.

Other teams don't persist in it. I can understand having a few goes, suck in the defence. Then you've got to roll the dice and have a crack!
The status quo clearly isn't working, it's not entertaining and it's not winning tests. Get it out the back FFS!

 

[Yoda]

Other teams don't persist in it. I can understand having a few goes, suck in the defence. Then you've got to roll the dice and have a crack!
The status quo clearly isn't working, it's not entertaining and it's not winning tests. Get it out the back FFS!

Yes! Agree 100%.

 

[Tomthumb]

Other teams don't persist in it. I can understand having a few goes, suck in the defence. Then you've got to roll the dice and have a crack!
The status quo clearly isn't working, it's not entertaining and it's not winning tests. Get it out the back FFS!

Yeah the whole point of pick & go's are to generate quick ruck ball, draw the defense in and on the back foot then use the space it creates

We seem to just pick and go with zero purpose behind it

 

[Major Tom]

Wallabies' Ikitau explains omission from Italy upset

Len Ikitau has explained why he was omitted from the Wallabies team that was beaten by Italy, as coach Joe Schmidt's selections and squad management come under heavy scrutiny.

www.espn.com.au

Been revealed that Schmidt left Ikitau out to get more time into the Paisami/JAS midfield. Always looks worse in retrospect I guess.

 

[JRugby2]

Yeah the whole point of pick & go's are to generate quick ruck ball, draw the defense in and on the back foot then use the space it creates

We seem to just pick and go with zero purpose behind it

Or score tries and generate penalties... like we've done several times this year.

Spreading the ball just because we've had a few cracks without success is bush league stuff.

 

[KOB1987]

Regardless, while Len is better then Paisami, as has been discussed elsewhere it was other aspects of the game that led to the defeat, most crucially errant kicking and isolation/ineffective cleanouts. Even if Len played and we scraped away with a win, those aspects would still be there, everyone would have been patting each other on the backs about the victory and it would sugar coat a poor performance. Hopefully the loss has led to a deep dive on these wider issues throughout the camp.

 

[rugbyAU]

Regardless, while Len is better then Paisami, as has been discussed elsewhere it was other aspects of the game that led to the defeat, most crucially errant kicking and isolation/ineffective cleanouts. Even if Len played and we scraped away with a win, those aspects would still be there, everyone would have been patting each other on the backs about the victory and it would sugar coat a poor performance. Hopefully the loss has led to a deep dive on these wider issues throughout the camp.

This has been said many times over the years

 

[John S]

This has been said many times over the years

And they're still there - and it comes back to the perennial question - is it a coaching issue or a player issue?

 

[Strewthcobber]

And they're still there - and it comes back to the perennial question - is it a coaching issue or a player issue?

Cheika, Rennie, Jones, Schmidt is a list of coaches of the highest quality - by record and reputation.

If that lot can't get performance out of a group of players, then the problem lies with the group of players.

 

[dru]

Cheika, Rennie, Jones, Schmidt is a list of coaches of the highest quality - by record and reputation.

If that lot can't get performance out of a group of players, then the problem lies with the group of players.

and the system that produces them.

 

[John S]

Yep, agree that there's something with possibly the systems - we're not seeing similar issues in the north (well, maybe Wales), or in NZ. We do also have a bigger player drain than other nations given our sporting context.

 

[LeCheese]

Surely the brains on this site can come up with a solution. Maybe we start a dedicated thread? Something like Where to for Australian Rugby?

Wait...